Yahoo Message Number: 57109 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57109)
Hi everyone, wanted to report that we had 6 of our defective SeGi windows rebuilt by RV Glass Solutions while in Yuma. They had a field guy in the area, Tim Lemmons, who also used to be a CC tech. Tim did a great job and also generously offered advice on some other problems.
This is a new service for them and they are rapidly expanding their capability in this area.
Phone 888/777-6778
Dan & Ann
1998 Allure #30180
Yahoo Message Number: 57115 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57115)
Would you mind telling us either on the forum or privately what the cost for this was? Also, do they have any type of warranty?
I've got 5 windows that need repair and was wondering if I would get it done here in AZ before we leave or in Oregon on the way back from Seattle.
Bob
'05 Intrigue 11872
Yahoo Message Number: 57117 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57117)
Good morning Bob,
I had 10 windows repaired on my '99 Allure. Dave Root out of Bend, OR. did them while he was in AZ this January. Did an excellent job, very professional and knows what he is doing. He and his partner worked @ Beaver before Beaver moved to Coburg, OR., building coaches so he understands the process. He charged me $2500.00 and it took him a day and a half to complete the job. Very satisfied and will use him again if any of the others fail.
W. S. (Bill) Burford
'99 Allure, #30307
Yahoo Message Number: 57120 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57120)
Bob:
I had Tim Lemon, former CC factory Tech, repair my P/S, L/R window, $285. Tim does excellent work. Warranty is a year.
I have 2 windows, entry door window and windshield which I will have Tim fix when I get back to the OR area.
John Beach
06 Allure 31309
Yahoo Message Number: 57122 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57122)
I had 8 windows resealed by Auto Glass Boss in Apache Junction, AZ. 602-505-3803. He charged me $75.00 per pane for a total of $600.00. Joe Colvin owner came to my site and completed all window in one day. Joe removed the valances and then removed the window frames with glass intact. Joe then separated the individual windows, separated the panes, removed the old sealant, cleaned the interior side of the glass, applied new 3M soft sealant, reassembled the panes, reinstalled panes in coach, reinstalled valances, cleaned inside and outside of glass.
Joe did the work on 2/24/2010 and we have had a lot of rain and some nice weather since work was done without any issues. Joe claimed he has been do this kind of work for 4 years and has only had to redo one window. He also does a lot of work for several RV Centers in the Mesa, AZ. area. He has been doing a lot of work with a Alfa group. He went to Palm Springs and I think he claimed to have worked on half dozen or more Alfa's.
Joe has numerous tattoo's, however, he was very nice and friendly. Seemed to know what he was doing.
I had a quote from RV Glass Solution in Phoenix that was over $1500.00 for the same work and I would need to take the coach to them. They also weren't sure they would be able to complete the same work in a day.
Jock Vargo
2005 Inspire330
51428
Yahoo Message Number: 57125 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57125)
Country Coach replaced a number of my double-pane windows under warranty, some more than once. That experience makes me wonder if the problem was with the quality of construction by SeGi (and whoever makes the driver's window and the entry door window), or if the problem is one of design.
By removing a window, overhauling and reinstalling it... are we just kicking the can down the road awaiting the next failure?
Is there another vendor out there in RVland whose windows DO NOT fail?
Jay
05 Inspire 51457
Yahoo Message Number: 57128 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57128)
We are looking for help in a decision.
We have an 06 Inspire and tend to put a fair amount of miles on our coach. It's our RV for fun, but we also have a manufacturer's rep agency and travel in the coach for work.
Our coach has about 50,000 miles on it, it's 4 years old, and it's time to change tires. Our tire guy has strongly suggested Bridgestone tires, 100,000 mile truck tires to be exact. Does anyone have any experience with these tires and/or suggestions for our coach.
Michelins are what we were thinking, but the truck man says we'd be very happy with these.
Thank you in advance for your help, and to the whole group, it's great to be able to send these emails out to you for help.
Mike
06 Inspire 51784
Yahoo Message Number: 57134 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57134)
We have a 2004 Allure and are also buying tires. Our tire guy (Pro Tire in Denton, TX) said the exact same thing about Bridgestone. We've ordered them and they will be put on this week. He said Michelin owns Bridgestone. I searched on rv.net and found a few RV owners that bought them and liked the ride. We have Toyo tires (original tires) and the front tires are cupping. He said Bridgestone tires should not have that problem. He's coming to the park and changing the tires, balancing and alignment. Please keep the group posted on your decision and outcome and we'll do the same.
Lonny & Diane Livingston
'04 Allure # 31065
Yahoo Message Number: 57135 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57135)
Jock, I assume you had seal creep or moisture or both. What does he do differently from SeGi to prevent recurrence? No vacuum I presume?
Rich 2002 Magna
Yahoo Message Number: 57136 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57136)
oops. I made an error. We looked at Bridgestone and our tire guy said the same thing, but we decided on BF Goodrich. Michelin owns them. My apologies. Please keep us posted on your decision.
Lonny & Diane Livingston
'04 Allure # 31065
Yahoo Message Number: 57137 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57137)
It was $2200 for six windows. All the ones on the passenger side and the driver side bedroom window.
Yahoo Message Number: 57138 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57138)
Penninsula Glass aka Motion Glass, in Vancouver, WA. From what I hear, their windows are engineered differently and do not fail. You can order and they will send.
Rich 2002 Magna.
Yahoo Message Number: 57140 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57140)
When I started researching for tires two years ago this coming Spring, I went back and read emails on this site and Foretravel's. The few comments that I remember were that everyone was satisfied with the Bridgestone. But a few owners who had more experience and owned multiple coaches felt the ride was stiffer and less compliant than Michelin XZ2A 275 R80 for the lighter coaches and 315's for the Heavier coaches. The XZ2 12R which is a highway long haul tire, and the XZE 12R which is a regional tire with more tread and an extra buffer on the sidewalls each have their own properties, were quieter and absorbed seams in pavement and cracks better than the Bridgestone. I bought XZ2 12R's for the coach.
They are quieter and absorb ruts, cracks, and seams better than the Toyo.
They seem to let me sooner if I am over driving the coach in corners where the slope is away from the center. As the side wall is a little softer than the Toyo. However a pot whole still gives that unpleasant sound and jolt when crossed. The Foretravel people who used to run the smaller tire, were always very careful to keep their tires fully inflated, due to side wall failures when in hot climates. That involved the 2000 thru 2004 coaches as I remember. I used Continentals on My 98 Allure and was very happy, and I should have ordered Michelin when the Intrigue was built. Installing the new tires made for a completely new and satisfying experience. Like buying a new coach.
TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731 PS they eliminated the coaches wanting to wander.
Yahoo Message Number: 57143 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57143)
Rich,
I only had moisture in my windows. No seal creep.
Jock Vargo
2005 Inspire 330
51428
Yahoo Message Number: 57145 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57145)
Lonny, Pat installed BF Goodrich on my 03 Magna in March 06,have put 40k plus on them, great tire. Still not sure about Pat though, LOL
Ray G
03 Magna 6267
Mar 8, 2010 02:54:32 PM,
Yahoo Message Number: 57147 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57147)
Any more info on the "3m soft sealant" that was used????
Ray
05 Allure 31176
Yahoo Message Number: 57148 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57148)
I hope you have better luck with the guy you're buying from than I did. I had him do a front end alignment, or at least I paid for one, but don't believe it was done. I tried to call him twice, but he never returned my phone calls. He did it in the Buddy Gregg campground in Lewisville, Texas and I paid through Buddy Gregg. I think he didn't do the alignment and that is why he wouldn't return my calls. Keep an eye on him, I don't trust him.
R. D. Vanderslice
06 allure 470 31294
--
Yahoo Message Number: 57154 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57154)
Just for the record.........there is no way your coach, car, truck, Suv, or lil red coaster wagon can be aligned on a portable align rack. Unless you are on an "in ground rack" computer sensor wheel caps ( all 4 ) with all four wheels down, air pressure checked, coach level, ride height set.
You are just throwing your money away....period AL
00 affinity #5851
Yahoo Message Number: 57157 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57157)
The problem lays with SEGI making an inferior product and CC for continuing to use SEGI windows year after year when it is know the product is faulty.
ddtuttle
aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443
Yahoo Message Number: 57159 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57159)
The dual pane window technology was behind the government EPA VOC rules. In other words the adhesive used in the separators (between the glass) did not have the ability to hold the increase and decrease of ambient pressure at bay.
Sea level = 14.7 PSI
At 7,000 feet = 11.34 PSI
Our coaches experience a significant change in barometric pressure and something has to compensate for the pressure changes at elevation.
Might not seem like a big difference, but on a static system it all adds up.
Major window manufactures that supply to the stick home market have hi altitude windows that allow for compensation of pressure. So that less of their windows fail.
I am not so quick to blame SeGi.. 100%. There is plenty of fault to go around. Gov't regs being high on the list.
The SeGi customer service "was"? a weak point.. as they should have priced (with enough profit) the wholesale of their windows to coach mfgs to allow for a higher failure rate... and better customer service.
Just a thought, Russ
05 Intrigue 11883 (with five bad windows yet to be fixed)
Yahoo Message Number: 57161 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57161)
Installed Bridgestones about 10,000 miles ago. They have been very good.
Balanced the front with Equal. Did not balance the rears.
Dean
95 Magna 5280
Yahoo Message Number: 57162 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57162)
We have a 2005 Inspire and recently replaced the tires with Michelins. We are extremely satisfied with the tires. In fact, had I know how much the ride would have improved by replacing the Toyo tires with Michelins, I would have done it when I purchased the coach new.
As for ProTire, I live very near Denton, TX and I have done business with Pat several times. He is very experienced, gracious, and dependable, He has done tire fixes at my house, did an alignment at my house, and installed the new Michelins at my house. I obviously value his service and will continue to do business with him.
Hodge Phillips
2005 Inspire
#51319
Yahoo Message Number: 57164 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57164)
Hodge
What Michelin's did you replace your Toyo's with and the size?? Thanks Ned Herrmann
06 Inspire 51677
Yahoo Message Number: 57183 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57183)
I am assuming that SEGI, being from California, assembled their windows nearer to sea level than to high altitude. Thus, why would the gasket move in toward the center of the window rather than out against the frame? Unless the gaskets allowed the higher internal pressure at high altitude to leak out and then at lower altitude the higher outside pressure could then force the gasket in. If indeed, the fault lies with the adhesive, then they should have gone and talked to 3-M.
ddtuttle
aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443
Yahoo Message Number: 57188 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57188)
I had Tire Pro aligne my coach at Buddy Gregg in Lewisville in 2000 and have had no problems. Have 80,000 miles on the coach and tires are wearing normally and drive like a dream. This was after my OEM Toyo tires had cupped quite a bit after only 8,000 miles and the handling of the coach was terrible.
Got rid of the Toyo steer tires and replaced them with Goodyear.
Egon
'99 Allure #30321
Yahoo Message Number: 57189 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57189)
I have heard so many stories as to why SeGi seal creep occurs I do not know what to believe. The last story was that SeGi puts a vacuum in there and that with thermal and altitude changes the seals therefore creep inwards towards the vacuum. I have very bad seal creep in a number of windows and no moisture, BTW.
Rich 2002 Magna
Yahoo Message Number: 57192 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57192)
I have Bridgestone tires on the front of my 95 Magna. NOT BAD, Handles good
Steve
95 Magna 5220
Yahoo Message Number: 57193 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57193)
The adhesive manufacturer for the spacer carries a large part of the responsibility .. I agree.
But no one knows if they had a disclaimer attached to their product that precluded the product from specific uses.. Like recreational vehicles.
Love to find out.
In a past life we owned a window and door company and each manufacturer dealt with high altitude applications differently.
Some manufacturers had a significant failure rate just shipping the boxed product over the Rocky Mountains.
The trip over the high altitude passes would break the seal and then when the product reached sea level in a humid environment the window would start to show signs of fogging up. Creeping seals would also be a problem under this scenario.
High altitude dual pane window construction typically includes a breather tube. One of the best window companies, Andersen Windows, for warranty purposes, has an altitude limit of only 5,000 feet on many of their products. All windows above their limits must have a breather tube.
The SeGi people may have been in the wrong business. We would not have attempted to build a product for the use in an RV. Or if we did, each and every window would have had a breather tub.. but the breather tube IMHO would easily have been an entrance point for moisture and fogging.
Russ and Jean
05 Intrigue
11883
Yahoo Message Number: 57214 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57214)
We have had Firestones, owned and manufactured by Bridgestone, for about a year now. They ride better than the Toyo's did and so far we are very happy with them. A little cheaper as well and with close to 10,000 miles no unusual wear patterns - they appear to be good tires.
Besides the price, I avoided Michelins because of warranty/support concerns expressed on this list in the past. Has this improved?
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57217 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57217)
Suncoast Designers, Hudson, FL has repaired seveal of our Se-Gi windows and those of many other members of this list. I spoke with one of the SD owners and he made some interesting comments.
SD originally were, and probably still are if the market has improved enough, maufacturers of custom home windows and doors not RV products. He said, in his opinion, the main mistake Se-Gi makes is trying to maintain a vacuum between the glass plates. As described already, the temperature and atmospheric pressure changes an RV experiences are going to eventually cause a failure and or creeping seals.
When they rebuild RV windows SD uses dried air between the glass sheets at armospheric (normal not a vacuum) pressure and different seals (they are obviously a different material when visually compared to the Se-Gi component). Since the only material they replace is the seal, I don't think the other materials Se-Gi used are problematic, it's the method of construction they use(d).
The Suncoast guy added that ALL dual pane RV window manufacturers have failures, Se-Gi is not exclusively the sourcce of all or even most RV window failures. I am in NO way trying to defend Se-Gi, just repeating what was said. I am sure any one of our windows could fail at any time given the stresses an RV provides.
We have had our repaired windows for well over a year with no problems. When it was possible to obtain Se-Gi replacements through CC every replacement failed in less than a year, one lasted 2 months. Every Se-Gi window in our coach has failed at least once. Suncoast provides a 5 year warranty, first year is a free rebuild, remainder of the time the cost to repair is prorated. I have heard of only a couple of returns.
So using the same materials Se-Gi used in the first place, with better seals and neutral air pressure seem to work fine. We have driven from sea level to across the continental divide and all over country. Se-Gi windows can be fixed - better, they can be manufacured right in the first place. It apparently isn't that hard.
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57227 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57227)
Here are some photos of Suncoast's process that Bob describes:
http://picasaweb.google.com/gharpercomcast/GlassRepair?feat=directlink (http://picasaweb.google.com/gharpercomcast/GlassRepair?feat=directlink)
George Harper
04 Allure
31093
Yahoo Message Number: 57242 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57242)
Excellent photographs. Thanks.
We recently had 6 windows remanufactured by Suncoast Designers. I got my tour of their process late one Friday evening, so I could not see the process in action since the workers that rebuild the windows had gone home.
That brings me to the work ethic that I found at SD. They normally work 6:30 to 3:00/3:30 (not sure which). They told me they would begin removing my windows first thing in the morning. They knocked on my door at 6:35am and started as promised. Normally they remove and reinstall the windows outside where your coach is parked which allows them to work multiple coaches at the same time. On our last day, however, there was a heavy rain which forced them to work coaches one at a time inside their shop. It was clear they would not finish by 3:30. As it turned out, we were the last coach of 6 or 7 that day. They started on our coach about 5:00pm and were finished by 6:30pm or so. We were still able to depart as scheduled the next day.
I could not be happier with
1) the technical aspects of their process
2) their work ethic
3) quality of reinstallation
4) and a more than reasonable price given the labor involved
Bill Brumley
06 Inspire # 51657
Yahoo Message Number: 57244 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57244)
Ned,
According to Toyo literature in my files, the Michelin size 295/80R22.5 is equivalent to Toyo 12R22.5 tires.
Nate Richards
04 Allure 31043
Yahoo Message Number: 57247 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57247)
Nate
Thanks. Our Inspire, from the factory, came with 11R's ( Toyo ). The issue I have with the 11R's is their weight carry capacity is near their max in the front. The 295/80R's max out at over 1200 lbs per tire higher and have the same outside diameter. I have no intent to overload the coach but like the margin better than operating at the tires wgt limit. I was hoping to find someone who installed 295's on an older Inspire and how they liked the performance. I believe the newer Inspires have 295's/ Ned Herrmann
06 Inspire 51677
Yahoo Message Number: 57251 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57251)
Ned:
I have a 2005 Inspire with Goodyear 295's on the front and Toyota 's on the rear and it works and handles great.
The right front passenger side Toyo wore the outside edge rib off and I had it aligned by Les Schwab in West Sacramento for $125 but I don't think they know what they were doing because it did not seem to change anything.
I went to Junction City and had the Goodyear's installed on the front and then to Eugene for an alignment at Kaisers for $338, for which they originally quoted $125. When I paid the bill they said that it has independent suspension so the price is for each side and the shims are $43 +++. They said the alignment was way out.
The Goodyear's work fine and handle the bombed out Interstate 5 through the central valley better than the Toyo's did.
In the past 10,000 miles the passenger outside front tire is showing very slight wear on the outside rib so I am probably due for another alignment.
Now I need to find someone else to do it.
One more thing, I experienced wander with both types of front tires which was corrected by raising the front ride height about ¾ inches. I cut a ¾ square inch wood stick the length of the shock for the correct ride height and adjusted the ride height valve to get that height. This makes it easy to check the ride height to make sure it stays where I want it.
Bob
2005 Inspire 51394
Auburn, CA
Yahoo Message Number: 57254 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57254)
George
Thanks for the pictures. I have one question. If the Dry Air is injected after the glass is re-assembled, how do they evacuate the air that is already in-between the glass?
ddtuttle
aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443
Yahoo Message Number: 57255 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57255)
As I have said before Michelin makes two 12R's. XZE, and XZ2. All direct replacements with the same ratings same diameter same tire pressure as the Toyo. The NEXT step up would be a 315 for the front, but even Mr Churchill and Dave Remington in the chassis department would not guaranty 315's would fit under my 04 Intrigue, so I stuck with the 12R's.
TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731
Yahoo Message Number: 57256 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57256)
Amen bill.
Compared to how we get treated by other RV service outlets working with Suncoast Designers was a pleasure. They actually act grateful for our business and are right up there with Fantastic Vent, Roadmaster and a very few other RV related companies that will continue to get my business as long as I can drive.
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57258 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57258)
We've got about 20K miles on the Michelin XZE 12Rs. They are "regional" tires which Michelin claims to have beefier sidewalls, which I think provides less risk for blowouts?. They ride smooth and quiet and show hardly any signs of wear.
Larry 03 Allure, 30856
Yahoo Message Number: 57259 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57259)
Bob said:
"I went to Junction City and had the Goodyear's installed on the front and then to Eugene for an alignment at Kaisers for $338, for which they originally quoted $125. When I paid the bill they said that it has independent suspension so the price is for each side and the shims are $43 +++. They said the alignment was way out."
Yeah, right. I don't know it for a fact but that sounds fishy as heck; similar to the tire guy some years ago who told me it would cost more to change a flat for the spare with a 10 lug wheel/tire than an 8.
Did they provide a spec sheet showing the alignment changes they made? Josams in Orlando, highly recommended by many including CC tech support, provided me a two page report diagramming the alignment settings before and after.
As I recall it may actually be easier to align an independent front suspension than a solid axle because for a solid axle to adjust caster requires placing/changing shims under the leaf springs and a camber change requires a torch to heat and bend the axle. Toe adjustment should be the same operation for either design. Independent front suspension changes to caster and camber require loosening a bolt or two and adding or substracting shims as needed. The upper control arm, where the shims are placed, has no weight on it so all it takes is a pry bar to open the space after loosening the bolt. A lot less work than u-bolts holding weight bearing springs together and torches.
Mikee - correct me if needed as I am frequently wrong on suspension issues.
If I need work I contact Coach Net or a similar type service and ask for a referral to a business they know. Those businesses want the repeat referrals so are less likely to treat me as a customer they will never see again so they might as well take all they can get out of my wallet. I learned this the hard way a few years ago when it cost me 3 times as much for a trailer tire through Coach Net versus driving in to a dealer cold myself. Not kidding, 3 times the price and the Coach Net was a road service call not a drive into the shop.
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57261 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57261)
Dave:
Just a guess here - at that point the glass is pretty hot from coming out of the sealer. The air being injected is much cooler and lowers the temp and thereby reduces the pressure between the plates which makes room for at least some of it. Otherwise they might just be trying to replace what is in there by exchanging it - so to speak.
I suspect the only "drier" in the system is the separator in the air supply line, nothing high tech about it that I saw or was pointed out to me. They said the vacuum Se-Gi uses adds to the failure potential so they go for a neutral pressure instead.
Whatever they do it is working for the windows they repaired on our coach and based on the volume of business they have done thousands. The love Se-Gi windows and RVers. ;-)
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57262 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57262)
BOB
I like your idea about 295's on the front. Are you running 11R's on the back?? A couple years ago, we were out in your area (live in Florida) and I needed alignment. The coach we were traveling with ( SOB ) called his factory for a recommendation on an alignment shop. They told him there were only 4 shops in the US to use and one was Henderson's in Grants Pass and that's where we were staying. I had them align the coach and turned it into a new machine. Little pricey but worth every penny. Tire wear on the front is flat. Great people.
Ned Herrmann
06 Inspire 51677
Yahoo Message Number: 57271 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57271)
Hi Larry, You are correct. The XZ2's do not have the side wall support as the XZE's. Curb a XZ2, and you have weakened the side wall. Then you can expect a blow out in that area of the side wall.
Chuck & Mary B
Laughlin, NV
Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat
Yahoo Message Number: 57272 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57272)
I am trying to find a way to keep the drawers from sliding out on turns. We have the metal drawer guides and there seems to be a latching mechanism on the back of the drawer guide but it does not keep some of the drawers from sliding out. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks
Chuck K
Intrigue 12298
.
(http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=2801132/grpspId=1705126185/msgId=57271/stime=1268438813/nc1=4507179/nc2=4025338/nc3=5522123)
Yahoo Message Number: 57275 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57275)
Bob
I had Les Schwab aline our coach and they used work horse chassis settings. After about 3,000 miles my drivers side started to wear the outside really bad. I had Country Coach send me the correct settings and Les Schwab re aligned it to factory settings (free) and 30,000 miles later I have no uneven wear. I had them rotate the tires because if you leave a un even worn tire on a steer axel even after alignment it will still wear more. Quoted from a tire guy. I did loose the wandering when I had the wrong settings and got the wandering back when set back to factory. I would not hesitate to go back to Les Schwab, and I will have a copy of the correct factory settings in my hand.
When I replace my tires I plan on using Toyo tires again. I hear people write and say they get a better ride with different tires. It has been my experience that any time I install new tires I always experience a better ride, I was told it is because there is more tread than the ones taken off.
My 2 cents worth John with foggy windows 04 Allure 31060 Orangevale
Yahoo Message Number: 57277 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57277)
Ned:
Yes I am still running the original 11R's in the back.
I will replace them soon since the six year life is fast approaching.
Thanks for the info on Henderson 's.
Bob
2005 Inspire 51394
Yahoo Message Number: 57278 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57278)
Chuck:
What you need are Grabber Catch Latches available from www.southco.com/ (http://www.southco.com/) That is what came on my coach and they work.
Bob
2005 Inspire 51394
Auburn, CA
Yahoo Message Number: 57279 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57279)
I have used Kaisers in Eugene before, and was even sent to them by Country Coach for a problem that they couldn't fix. Kaisers had me fixed and out the door within 4 hours with a full alignment, shims and all. I would not hesitate to go back to them. They are very reputable from my point of view and experience.
Jim Hill
2008 Tribute 260
81138
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57281 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57281)
Ned,
We are looking at new tires for our Inspire as well. Our '06 Inspire came with the Goodyear G670 295's and we are looking at Michelin alternatives since everyone talks so highly of them. In addition we were warned about "DOT" dates on the Goodyears out there as some of the NEW tires are already 2 years old. We are replacing due to age not wear. If you plan on upgrading the weight capacity of your tires make sure your wheels can handle the extra capacity our you could be asking for trouble. Let us all know what you decide on.
Safe Travels,
Kathy
'06 Inspire #51782
Yahoo Message Number: 57282 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57282)
Bob
That makes sense. Seeing as the glass is hot when it is reassembled I suppose there is very moisture in it. Injecting air to more equalize it under normal conditions would hopefully make the windows better. I wonder why SEGI , after all these years of failures, did not try that. Although air in between the two glass pieces would make them less efficient insulation wise compared to a vacuum.
ddtuttle
aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443
Yahoo Message Number: 57284 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57284)
A well taken point John that is often forgotten here.
Don Seager
2004 Allure 31046
Yahoo Message Number: 57285 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57285)
BOB
Thanks for the info. I like your idea with the 295's on the front. A couple years ago, we were on a trip through your part of the country ( live in Florida ) traveling with friends. Their SOB company service center said there were only 4 shops in the US for alignment. We happened to be in Grants Pass and Henderson's was one of them. I took our Inspire to them and had it done. What a great job, like a different coach and tire wear is still normal. Little pricey but totally satisfied.
Ned Herrmann
06 Inspire 51677
Yahoo Message Number: 57287 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57287)
Once a front end is properly aligned the only way it changes is something gets bent... Straight axles especially. The Toe may need tweaking from time to time, but the caster and camber usually do not change. IFS may change a little over time due to wear, but not enough to make any difference. I am not real sure what your question is?
Mikee
Yahoo Message Number: 57288 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57288)
Foggy John:
Did you use the West Sacto . Schwab store do the alignment? I asked them about switching the front worn tire to the rear and one of their guys felt the rear tire and said that the rear was wearing funny and that switching it was not a good idea. He must have been more knowledgeable than me since I could see no abnormal wear on any of the rear tires.
Are you with the FMCA 4Wheelers group and if so were you in Kingman in November? Bob
2005 Inspire 51394
Yahoo Message Number: 57293 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57293)
Hi David,
A few bits of info about insulated dual pane windows... SeGi didn't have a vacuum between the glass. Their dual glazed units have always had dry air in between.
If it was a vacuum (at 14.7 PSI) the glass would have broken from the external pressure or concaved in the middle.
What SeGi does (like all of the other window companies) is assemble the units in a dry air environment so as to not have any moisture laden air in between the panes. The high quality residential window manufactures such as Andersen, inject Argon gas as it has lower heat transfer properties.
Neutral pressure is always the goal. It is the change in pressure as we travel from different stopping points that causes the break down and eventual fogging of the glass. Larger windows have a tendency to flex in the middle to offset the pressure changes, while the smaller windows break down around the adhesive sealed edge to compensate. In most cases leakage and fogging is caused by the sun drying out the adhesives in the seal and then the slight loss of adhesion allowing pressure changes to pull moisture laden air in between the glass. The change in pressure is what causes the creeping seals, too. As the air pressure inside the glass attempts to neutralize itself to ambient conditions the seals move.
The best solution is to have the highest quality adhesive available and or a pressure compensation weep hole in each window.. but the later will allow moisture in eventually...sad to say.
Hope this helps,
Russ
05 Intrigue
11883
Yahoo Message Number: 57296 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57296)
David
They do not pull a vacuum. They just shoot dry air in and plug it and hope atmospheric pressure changes do not cause a problem. Maybe the seal they use is very resistant to movement unlike SiGi.
George Harper
04 Allure
31093
Yahoo Message Number: 57300 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57300)
Jim,
Glad to hear it. I stand corrected.
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57302 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57302)
Mikee:
The question was why a customer would be told aligning an IFS would cost twice as much as a solid axle because "both sides need to be done." This was the justification for increasing a quote of $125 to about $400.
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178
Yahoo Message Number: 57315 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57315)
Bob, The gentleman that did my second alignment at Les Schwab in West Sac is the one informed me that if I leave the worn tire on the front it would continue to wear, so per his recommendation I had them installed on the inner rear driver. At the time there was 20,000 on my tires. We all talk about the ride on our coaches and my Allure rides better than any of the vehicles I currently own. I love the air ride. We were in Kingman in Feb and no I do not belong to the 4W FMCA, but I do have a Jeep with a nice front bumper that I built with winch. Hoping not be Foggy window John for much longer,04 Allure 31060 --- On Sat, 3/13/10, Robert Cole wrote:From: Robert Cole Subject: RE: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Bridgestone tires anyone?To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.comDate: Saturday, March 13, 2010, 7:55 AM Foggy John:
Did you use the West
Sacto . Schwab store do the alignment? I asked them about switching the front worn tire to the rear and one of their guys felt the rear tire and said that the rear was wearing funny and that switching it was not a good idea. He must have been more knowledgeable than me since I could see no abnormal wear on any of the rear tires.
Are you with the FMCA 4Wheelers group and if so were you in Kingman in November? Bob
2005 Inspire 51394
Yahoo Message Number: 57317 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/57317)
Well, there could be a lot of variables here... Not saying what happened. but here are some things to consider.
Was it a front end alignment or a front and rear alignment
Straight axle alignments are usually only check camber, caster and set toe. If something is off on a straight axle, something is bent or broken. Alignments usually consider this in their pricing.
IFS does have shims and can be set, usually not needed but.... If it changes slightly due to wear the shims can correct, but it if something changed enough to cause that big of a change it should probably be replaced.
Caster causes the wheels to try to go straight and return to straight when turning.
Camber is the tilt of the wheel, top to bottom Toe is the difference between the front of the tire and the rear, usually 1/8 on 22" rubber.
And remember all numbers are based on the machine used, it is rare for 2 machines to return the same numbers. It depends on when the machine was last calibrated, set up on the front end, operator preference or opinion as to what they feel is right or their experience. (How many chili recipes do you know of?)
All of this being said, once the front end is set correctly, if it changes enough to cause it to be off far enough to need resetting, the cause should be determined and corrected.
If tire wear is okay, the front end is most likely close enough. It is not rocket science.
If it is off enough to need adjustments and you KNOW it used to be correct the cause should be found and corrected, this will usually bring the alignment back to the right numbers.
A straight axle can be bent to change the numbers, but if it was right and is now off, it is bent or a mounting point, kingpin, or spring mount is in need of attention.
It you want the get consistent info, use a shop you can return to later. Ask for the front end to be checked, this involves setting it up on the machine and the settings read.
Then step 2 is adjusting it, then final numbers
When the front end is aligned, especially IFS the ride height should always be set to the same as it was for the first alignment, air pressure set . This affects Toe more than anything.
New tires will usually improve driving and sometime ride. It is rare new tires improve ride to the point you can really tell it. Ever notice how much nicer the coach is after you have it detailed or you detail it...
Toe has more influence on drive ability than anything else. If something is bent or broke that is not an alignment issue, it affects alignment, but the alignment is the result not the cause.
Loose rear end set ups cause more problems than front ends, when something is loose in the rear the coach will wander, never go straight, etc as the rear end is steering. Think forklift here.
Ever notice NASCAR usually adjusts the rear end not the front... These cars have stagger, offset and other stuff built into the chassis the improve left turns. Short track and long track cars are different. Cars used at Daytona are not used at a short track, different straight away distances, etc. They are built different.
The ride and drive ability improvements are usually more perceived than real.
I would get a good 4 wheel alignment, it sets the front and rear ends parallel to each other. if it does not go straight going down the road it will never be a good driver.
Mikee
Yahoo Message Number: 59881 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/59881)
Can anyone recommend someone to reseal my fogged windows in the Southern California area.
Thanks........
Tony
2005 Inspire 330
51336
Yahoo Message Number: 60418 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/60418)
We are curious as to how long or what type of guarantee have any of you gotten from the places that did your windows about how long your windows would last either before they might fog up, weep, whatever again. Did these places give you any type of time frame or guarantee?
We asked Loyalty Innovations in Goodlettsville, who has done custom work on our rig & just plain does all kinds of custom work for RV', military, fire you name it, and they said they couldn't guarantee the windows for more than a year.
Maybe there was some sort of misunderstanding on our part?
Anyone care to elaborate?
Dee Ross
$31529 2007 Allure
Yahoo Message Number: 60425 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/60425)
We had our windows repaired at Suncoast Designers Hudson, FL. Their guarantee is 1 year 100%, then 2-5 years prorated. We highly recommend them for their price and excellent service. We got an estimate at Lazydays in Tampa and they were more expensive and only gave a 90 day guarantee.
2004 Allure 33'
#31065
Yahoo Message Number: 60470 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/60470)
We'll third the Sun Coast Design folks as #1 in every respect. First class service all he way, nice people, fair prices and excellent work.
Guarantee is as stated, 5 years pro-rated except first year is free repair and not prorated.
We are into our second year with no failures. Brand-new replacement Se-Gi widows failed within a month.
Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178