Yahoo Message Number: 22673 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22673)
We are about to take the plunge and while we like the 42' Allure with 4 slides more than the 40' Inspire triple (Genoa), we don't think we like it $100,000 more.
My only problem with the Inspire is that when on the test drive it felt like there was about two inches of play in the steering wheel and that the coach would slowly "float" left and right requiring constant correction to keep tracking straight.
The Allure with the tag axel was much much better.
I'm not sure either, however, was as precise as the Monaco Dynasty which seemed to track very well without requiring much correction which I figured would reduce fatigue and annoyance on long trips.
On the other hand, the ride in the Country Coaches seems smoother and quieter than the Dynasty and the Country Coaches seem to be much nicer.
I just don't have enough experience driving coaches (though drove a bus in college) to know if this sort of vague steering is par for the course or not. My daily driver is a Porsche so I may be suffering unrealistic expectations.
A friend suggested the alignment could be off on the Inspire but it is not only brand new but does not seem to prefer to pull to one side over the other so I'm not convinced that would be it.
Given the price difference, I guess I'm hoping everyone will tell me they all do that and I should learn to live with it so we can just get the Inspire.
Any experienced observations would be appreciated.
Yahoo Message Number: 22675 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22675)
When I took possesion of our 2000 Allure, I had a similar experience.
Had it checked at a service shop and found the front wheel "toe-in" was actually toed-out. Correcting the toe-in made all the difference, no more wandering.
Dave
2000 Allure 36'
#30444
faterikcartman wrote:
Yahoo Message Number: 22676 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22676)
Hi there, Whatever decision you make be sure you verify the status of each coach before you take it out for a drive.
Coaches steer quite differently when the tire pressure is high. In recent months the industry has been recommending tire pressures that match the rating on wall of the tire and consequently the front tires may be at least 120 pounds.
If the coach is unloaded (personal belongings) and low on fuel it will not handle as comfortably as it will when you have loaded 3000 plus pounds of 'stuff'.
To compound the weight issue, a full load of fuel in a tank just behind the front wheels will make an incredible difference.
Although the industry has gone to inflating tires to the manufacturers limit to avoid liability there are many owner operators who consider this to be 'over kill' and run their tires at lower pressures in front and back based on the weight of their specific coaches.
The point is, that to compare steering and ride first make sure the tires on all coaches you drive are at the manufacturers limit. Also, be aware if the coach has a nearly full tank or nearly empty.
Assuming they are new coaches there should be no 'stuff' inside the bays.
It is my understanding that Country Coach deliver their coaches with the front shocks set at the intermediate firmness setting. With the recent change in philosophy regarding operating pressures there may be a re consideration of the shock settings.
There have been owners on this forum that have had their shocks adjusted to the firm ride option to change the ride characteristic of the coach. Right now there is not a lot of data to say if this is a good change or not but be aware it is an option.
Assuming the alignment is correct on the subject coaches there is one more variable, and that is the driver.
Time behind the wheel will solve some of your worries. As you get more comfortable with the size, weight, braking, etc. you will be more relaxed and most of the over corrections on the steering will disappear.
However, be aware that your personal driving position may need to be adjusted compared to what you are used to in the Porsche. Placing the steering wheel close to the horizontal position and holding the wheel at one and eleven o'clock may make a big difference for you.
Hopefully you are working with a good dealer/salesperson who will be willing to make sure the test coaches are set up in a compatible way.
Good luck and safe travels. David
Yahoo Message Number: 22677 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22677)
those test drives are important. I made that mistake once, and if you follow your own gut don't buy the unit and don't buy the promise of a fix.
I have an Allure 2003 and it is the world of difference from an allure 1997.
Look at other units are drive units. D o not make my mistake
Thank you,
Jim Spivey
Yahoo Message Number: 22678 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22678)
Thanks Dave.
I should emphasise, however, that I have at least 6,000 hours behind the wheel of a bus -- quite likely more than full-timers put in in a lifetime -- so I am familiar with driving a large, long, heavy vehicle.
I am not, however, used to driving them with two inches or more of play in the wheel. I have experienced this in the American Coach products I've driven (Traditions and Eagle) so figured it could be what all IFS coaches do.
Good points on fluid and tire pressure but it sure feels like the steering linkage just has a lot of play.
Yahoo Message Number: 22679 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22679)
Jim, are you saying the 2003 is not as good as the 1997 or better?
you
of a fix.
allure 1997.
Yahoo Message Number: 22681 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22681)
Sorry the 2003 is much better. The Dealer (no longer sells CC) was just not truthful. There should be no play in the steering, anything short is unacceptable. Also that play will wear you out and you iwll not be able to drive as long as you once thought.
Thank you,
Jim Spivey
Yahoo Message Number: 22682 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22682)
Thanks Jim.
My wife would rather have new, but maybe the '03 Allure my local dealer just got in might be a better choice for about the same money or less than a new Inspire.
was just not
short is
be able to
Inspire?
and if
promise
Yahoo Message Number: 22684 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22684)
"Vague steering"
Much good information has already been proffered about "play" in steering. I concur with what has been said; and as I come to the end of having owned some 5 RVs, I wouldn't tolerate even a half inch--let alone two inches--of play in the steering system.. Others have already addressed the relationship between the necessity of constant steering correction and both excessive fatigue and immediate response to imminent danger.
My comments have to do with constant corrections as a function of (a)road condition and (b)crosswind. Even with "tight" steering, the heigth of road crowning and/or a quartering/beam-on crosswind can work one to near exhaustion. As an old airplane driver I may be unusually sensitive to these conditions; but where I use my RV, both conditions are all too frequently encountered. Finally I got smart, and had my current Intrigue" outfitted with a Howard steering system; a system which - like an airplane - allows the operator to "TRIM-OUT" the adverse effects of most road crowning and/or relatively strong crosswinds. The system will not cure "slack" in the steering train, but it does the correcting--- not the driver. My experience with it over nearly 100k miles, leads me to give priority to only P/S and A/T systems.
All best rog
Yahoo Message Number: 22685 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22685)
I noticed the same issue with mine. wht I also found was that adjusting the shocks from full soft up front to hard made a world of difference in general handling. No longer had the bouncing action and the turn in was nice. There is still a bit of play in the wheel and I would like to see it tighter but in general it ok. rather see the transmission temps come down with auxilary oil cooling before I worry about the steering play.
Kary
05 Inspire 36'
#51499
Yahoo Message Number: 22688 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22688)
We had similar issues with our new '05 Inspire. It did not have the play in the steering, but it did have a mind of its own when driving on smooth roads with little or no crown, and also when cruising down the freeways. It would suddenly pull (just like a strong, sudden crosswind, only there was no wind at all) toward either direction at any speed in excess of 40 miles per hour. I never knew when it would do it, so I had to be prepared at all the time. This is not conducive to a restful trip. My wife was just as nervous and exhausted after trips that were only 2-3 hours long.
The problem turned out to be alignment. If the alignment is out and the coach starts to porpoise from any dips in the road or even on smooth roads, the unloading of the front steering would cause the coach to pull, in either direction. It was enough of a pull that the coach would have gone off the road when it occurred had I not been alert and corrected for it. It was aligned once by an alignment center in Eugene. It was a little better, but would still pull un-expectedly.
I finally had the factory re-align the coach, giving me both the pre and post alignment numbers for my records(and it was out of alignment). After the factory re-alignment, the coach drove like a dream and continues to do so. My wife and I have both relaxed, and enjoy our trips as much as our stays. We are very happy with the Inspire along with the factory response and corrective action. Country Coach stands behind their products and does their best to service the coaches to satisfy the customer. I strongly recommend their products and especially their commitment to customer satisfaction.
It also helps to be courteous and reasonable when requesting them to address issues that need corrective action. Becoming an irate customer does not improve the situation, nor does it inspire prompt action. Try to remember that nothing is perfect and that these coaches are very complex. I would venture to say, that all coaches will have problems, some more serious that others. Your attitude and response can assist or hinder the process of making things right.
Hope this helps,
Rich and Meg
05 Inspire, 51460
Yahoo Message Number: 22689 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22689)
Thanks Rich.
The test road had many dips on it though it did wander even when smooth. Perhaps previous drivers hit those dips too fast and put something out of whack. The good things you say about Country Coach are why they are our number one choice -- people love them.
It sounds like I should go back to the dealer and ask to drive one or two different Inspire's and see if there's any difference.
the play in the steering, but it did have a mind of its own when driving on smooth roads with little or no crown, and also when cruising down the freeways. It would suddenly pull (just like a strong, sudden crosswind, only there was no wind at all) toward either direction at any speed in excess of 40 miles per hour. I never knew when it would do it, so I had to be prepared at all the time. This is not conducive to a restful trip. My wife was just as nervous and exhausted after trips that were only 2-3 hours long.
and the coach starts to porpoise from any dips in the road or even on smooth roads, the unloading of the front steering would cause the coach to pull, in either direction. It was enough of a pull that the coach would have gone off the road when it occurred had I not been alert and corrected for it. It was aligned once by an alignment center in Eugene. It was a little better, but would still pull un- expectedly.
pre and post alignment numbers for my records(and it was out of alignment). After the factory re-alignment, the coach drove like a dream and continues to do so. My wife and I have both relaxed, and enjoy our trips as much as our stays. We are very happy with the Inspire along with the factory response and corrective action.
Country Coach stands behind their products and does their best to service the coaches to satisfy the customer. I strongly recommend their products and especially their commitment to customer satisfaction.
to address issues that need corrective action. Becoming an irate customer does not improve the situation, nor does it inspire prompt action. Try to remember that nothing is perfect and that these coaches are very complex. I would venture to say, that all coaches will have problems, some more serious that others. Your attitude and response can assist or hinder the process of making things right.
Yahoo Message Number: 22690 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22690)
Oh, I should add that it didn't really pull, at least not hard, nor did it have a favourite direction. It just drifts over to one side you can wiggle the wheel and nothing happens and then if it started to drift too far I would need to just ever so gently turn the wheel just a teeny bit over just to get it back on track but that would just start it drifting over in the other direction and back and forth.
Coach
the
the
them
prompt
and
Yahoo Message Number: 22692 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22692)
We took almost a year to choose our coach, test driving many over the same course at some times. If we hadn't driven several CC's and seen that it all depended on how the dealers set the tire pressures, etc., we might not be driving a CC now. Over all the tests, we found on the average we liked the CC drive best over other brands. However, when we finally got OUR CC, it drove terribly! I was even unwilling to drive it at all. Then, someone on this forum suggested checking the tire pressures for the weight (I know this isn't really done anymore, but it DID make a HUGE diff!)...it ended up solving the entire problem and our rig drives awesome still...after 5 years of fulltiming it's still perfect...I can track it for many seconds with hands off the wheel on a road as an example. Try the simple things first is what we learned.
By the way..have a fellow in the park we're in now who has a 6-month old Inspire and loves it...has had no problems at all with it.
Jan McNeill
2001 Intrigue 11320
Yahoo Message Number: 22698 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22698)
David made some very good points regarding learning experience with a new coach and modifying personnal driving methods. i.e. Tyre Pessures -When I took delivery of our Inspire the tyres had 100psi and I had no real problems with ride, steering etc. Then during our first 5,00 mile service 3 weeks ago, R-Mechanic increased tyre pressures to 120psi with the comment of "offering a better ride/handling". And sure enough there was a major difference to the better.
Weight - Agree handling is firmer with full tanks, and less tendancy to bounce. I always try to keep the tanks >50% full.
Shocks - Have not found a need to change settings as yet.
Road Conditions - Just keep very close attention to how other vehicles are bouncing down the road 200 yds in front and adjust your speed accordingly.
Steering Wheel position - Being on the short side, the horizontal wheel trick driver position does not work for me, as I can barely reach the extremity of the wheel if in horizontal position. So wheel has to be tilted down 25degree or so. Which gives me more positive wheel control to either feed the wheel from hand to hand or around the rim.
Pedals height, Seating height, location and Wheel position - Took me almost 6 months to define ideal balanced driving position for these.
Heater and A/C controls - Are all too low for me to operate safely while driving, especially as they are way out of line of sight and reach. I have to lean over the wheel slightly to adjust and have suffered steering wander when my body contacted the wheel.
Drives side manual Sunscreen - When in fully up closed position I cannot reach high enough it to pull down, so have to keep it lowered 3-4" for immediate use.
Agree some of these problems should be immdiately noticable during a test drive but may not become really apparent till driving for an extended period. Also the design ergonomics cannot be made to suit all. Also making adjustments while stationary may be fine, but a whole new ballgame when mobile.
Every vehicle has its own handling characteristics and learning curve. I also drive sports cars and an SUV.
T & P D.
06 Inspire 41554
In Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com (Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com), F102508@... wrote:
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Yahoo Message Number: 22699 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22699)
Vague Steering/new coach It is so true that it takes a while to get settled in a new rig. Our first test drive in a 40' Allure was awful. Loud, rough and did not impress us a bit. Our previous coach was on a Freightliner chassis and it floated on down the road and other than wind noise was very quiet. We had to look at the tach to see if the engine had started for we couldn't hear it up front.
Our 2nd test drive in another 40' Allure was better, but still a completely different feeling. We were told that when we got our 42' Allure it would be smoother and once we got it loaded and got comfortable with it, we'd do ok. I have to admit, we were a little dubious of the claim. Once we got to the dealer where our coach was and took it for a test drive, it was much better and they were right, once it was loaded, and we got used to a new rig and feeling, it is great now.
We too have to adjust the steering wheel and even tho' it has adjustable pedals, they don't adjust far enough forward for us. I added a piece of wood to the pedals so I can reach them better, and have finally got the seat to where I'm comfortable. It took a few trips to get adjusted to a new coach.
We drive with a high PSI in the tires because of what we carry, and the coach tracts well and doesn't wander at all. It is quite steady in the wind and once the wind gets to pushing us around, we figure it is time to quit anyway.
We changed out our sun screens all around for we found the screen material did not block out the sun enough. The sun shade over the pilot window is a solid material that we manually can adjust and we keep it within reach. The power ones up front did not have enough sun blocking either. They are of the same material, a solid cream color, that we can put anywhere to block the sun. We had these type of sun shades in our previous coach and liked them so much we ordered them for this one and swapped them out.
We've done a lot of customizations to make the coach ours and sure enjoy it.
Definitely test drive several coaches and ask lots of questions. Then once you pick one have fun making it "yours".
--
Sue
'05-42' Allure #31254
Yahoo Message Number: 22701 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22701)
Our '01 Allure handled poorly for me until I did the weight/tire pressure match-up and viola.... handles like a dream. We lowered our front tire pressure to 85 and the rears to 75... handles much better and the ride is exellent. The settings were done after a four corner weigh and a front and back axle weigh. We are fultimers for going on 5 years and love our CC.
Allen 30694 36' TS
the
seen
etc.,
the
when we
drive it
but it
and our
on a
month
Yahoo Message Number: 22702 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22702)
I do not what to be a smart ass, and I hope that this group understands, but you have done the tire pressure backwards. Low pressure more heat. In General fronts 120 PSI rear 105PSI. If you have "smart tiire" you can check this out for your self by just making one rear 85 and the next 105.
Then look at the temp. after a hour of so of driving. Shocks, tire presssure, are very important.
I just want to note to others that the tire pressure is important as a tire dealer or CC. Better yet there is a ton of mail on the Toro tire issue some weeks back.
Thank you,
Jim Spivey
Yahoo Message Number: 22703 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22703)
As an update, I checked the pressure on the front tires of the coach today -- 119 and 120 respectively.
And Jim, I read with some interest Toyo's position on their website. They say please don't put any of their tires on any Country Coaches, though this may have already been discussed before I joined the forum.
understands, but
heat. In
can check
tire
as a tire
issue some
Inspire?
fultimers
over
on
anymore,
still
wheel
learned.
Yahoo Message Number: 22705 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22705)
Jan,
Can you share how you found the best tire pressure for your coach and since we have an 01' Intrigue too, what pressure are you running?
I also wonder about replacing tires. What tires did you purchase? I am have a tough time deciting between the 80 series long mile truck tire that you can buy anywhere and the 70 series RV tire that is hard to find.
Paul
the
seen
etc.,
the
when we
drive it
but it
and our
on a
month
Yahoo Message Number: 22712 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22712)
You don't say what length your coach is, but if it's 40' you should go to the 80's without reservation. To protect that left front tire from the possibility of being over stressed while going down the road. The ride quality and steering and were greatly improved on my 36'. TWI 30255
Yahoo Message Number: 22714 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22714)
Jan,
Our Intrigue is 40' and we are running 105 psi on the front tires.
I did two front-end alignments and still get some wondering. We purchased the coach in 03' and the pressure was 95 psi. After getting is weighed at FMCA Rally, we increased the pressure.
Thanks for your reply.
Paul
01' Intrigue # 11309
should go to
from the
ride
30255
Yahoo Message Number: 22728 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22728)
Sue, what brand are your new sun screens. Our Intrigue didn't come with a driver side screen and we're looking for something. Can you tell me who sells the screens you have now?
Bob
'05 Intrigue 11872
it within
anywhere
coach and
Yahoo Message Number: 22732 (http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Country-Coach-Owners/conversations/messages/22732)
Re: [Country-Coach-Owners] Was "Vague Steering/new coach" - New Question about sun Screens I wish I knew what brand they were! They are used in the Alfa See Ya and Gold motorhomes so I contacted our friends (Charlie's Service) who have an RV repair service in Sunset, Utah. They own an Alfa See Ya so can get parts from the company quite easily, and they are an authorized Alfa repair service and also do work on Country Coaches. A great independent repair service...honest Christian folks.
Anyway, you can contact Vicki (her hubby is Charlie) and have her order you 1 manual "See Ya" blind for the pilot window and if you want the 12v electric ones for the front, you'll ask for 2 electric blinds. They are quite pricey, but IMHO they were worth it! I'll try to post a pix on the CC forum web site of the blinds.
You can reach Vicki at Charlie's Service 801-773-1193
She is in the office most of the time unless they can get away in their coach for a few weeks. They just attended the Alfa Nat. Rally, so they may be back by now.
Sue