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Water softener and reverse osmosis water treatment systems.

Yahoo Message Number: 40573
Maybe this will save you a bit of time in selecting means of water treatment for your coach.

Much has been written lately on motor home water treatment. Years ago I was trained on commercial water treatment systems and have started two commercial RO water systems since then. Both systems produced very pure H2O, as million $ systems should.

I do not expect to use RO water for all uses or even for daily drinking but will use it for all in areas like New Orleans area.
Makers of membranes for RO systems require clorine free feed water and advise use of softener before RO system. The membrane does separation of clean water from feed water, so softening before RO is good.
After several months of reading and shopping, parts for softener system are ready to be installed in my coach.
For my coach, two Kinetico water softener tanks and two filters were purchased. All water will be filtered then softened before feeding coach.
Having 2 softener tanks allows tank backflush and regeneration with filtered softened water.

A GE Merlin RO system is next to buy. Merlin waste water is much less than other systems. Merlin can make over 1/2 G/M and is intended for use without a storage tank. Not bad for $370.
Kinetico tanks were chosen for height and connections arrangements on tanks. I paid $400 for tanks, internal parts and tank top assemblies plus some PEX tube fittings, all shipped to me.

OhioPureWater.com sold me softener resin for tanks.
Menards had all the fittings and PEX tubing needed.
Omnifilter supplied filter housings for standard 2 X 10" filters.
Regeneration will be manual, using filter housing to feed dissolved salt.
A clothes washer fill switch will control level of water in storage tank.
A double electric valve will control storage tank fill from softener or from RO system.

Electric pipe heating tape will protect softener tanks and new PEX.

--

God Bless You,

Eric Lee Elliott

870.613.1398 or 800.827.5038

PMB 6755, 167 Rainbow Drive, Livingston TX 77399-1067
eric@...http://eric-elliott.com

Re: Water softener and reverse osmosis water treatment systems.

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 40598
Eric

I would love to see pics of your water treatment system when it is installed in your coach, and I bet others would too.

The RO I have left over from dialysis is a Zyzatech Millenium. The company was purchased by GE not long after I bought it.

Those thinking about an RO system should know that they take maintenance too in addition to that for the water softener tanks. On a regular basis the membranes have to be cleaned with a special agent and the membranes themselves have a finite life and have to be replaced. As you alluded to in yor post, if you let chlorine from municipal water systems get the membranes they are toast.

George Haper
04 Allure
31093

Quote from: Eric Lee Elliott\[br\
] >

Maybe this will save you a bit of time in selecting means of water

treatment

Quote
for your coach.

Much has been written lately on motor home water treatment. Years

ago I was

Quote
trained on commercial water treatment systems and have started two

commercial

Quote
RO water systems since then. Both systems produced very pure H2O,

as million

Quote
$ systems should.

I do not expect to use RO water for all uses or even for daily

drinking but

Quote
will use it for all in areas like New Orleans area.

Makers of membranes for RO systems require clorine free feed water

and advise

Quote
use of softener before RO system. The membrane does separation of

clean

Quote
water from feed water, so softening before RO is good.

After several months of reading and shopping, parts for softener

system are

Quote
ready to be installed in my coach.

For my coach, two Kinetico water softener tanks and two filters

were

Quote
purchased. All water will be filtered then softened before feeding

coach.

Quote
Having 2 softener tanks allows tank backflush and regeneration with

filtered

Quote
softened water.

A GE Merlin RO system is next to buy. Merlin waste water is much

less than

Quote
other systems. Merlin can make over 1/2 G/M and is intended for

use without

Quote
a storage tank. Not bad for $370.

Kinetico tanks were chosen for height and connections arrangements

on tanks. I

Quote
paid $400 for tanks, internal parts and tank top assemblies plus

some PEX

Quote
tube fittings, all shipped to me.
OhioPureWater.com sold me softener resin for tanks.
Menards had all the fittings and PEX tubing needed.
Omnifilter supplied filter housings for standard 2 X 10" filters.
Regeneration will be manual, using filter housing to feed dissolved

salt.

Quote
A clothes washer fill switch will control level of water in storage

tank.

Quote
A double electric valve will control storage tank fill from
softener or from
 

Re: Water softener and reverse osmosis water treatment systems.

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 40624
Eric,

Your message makes a lot of sense and introduces several new ideas for those of us who are interested in this subject. It sounds like your experience is deeper than mine by far. Your complete system is pretty pricey but, is sounds like it could be the best! I have a few questions and comments:
1. Most household RO systems filter out the chlorine with their pre-filters. Right?
2. I have a softener in-line for all water (except irrigation, of course) on my home base system. This soft water has, in fact, extended the life of the membrane.
3. You probably have access to commercial plumbing supply sources due to your previous business dealings. Are all the parts you mentioned available from DIY stores or do I need to deal with a wholesale plumbing supply house? Where did you find the G.E. "Merlin"?
4. What is the actual ratio gallons of waste water sloughed off to pure water produced?
5. I am not sure that I understand the need for two softener tanks.
6. What is the outlet pressure of the pure water which is being produced by the G.E "Merlin" membrane. Is it high enough to provide water to additional appliances? I have an InSinkErator "Insta-Hot" hot water dispenser installed in my galley sink.
7. Did you install your softener tanks inside of the coach? If inside, where?
8. Is the GE "Merlin" at $370 a complete pre-filter and membrane package unit? Did you install it under the galley sink? Could it be installed in a remote compartment and plumbed to the sink?

Final caveat, possible health concern: How do we deal with the fact that the purified water that we would store in our fresh water tank would have no traces of chlorine for protection? Would the stored water now be susceptible to the formation and multiplication of possibly harmful bacteria? It is my understanding that an RO system does not extract bacteria. I was made painfully aware of this when I sold an RO system to a nurse who tested the water in her hospital lab. Also, the motor coach environment introduces other factors that would not be considerations for a stationary system. The fresh water tank inhales and exhausts ambient air through the vent due to flexing of the side walls as the coach undulates in travel. This also takes place as the tank naturally "equalizes" with changes in atmospheric pressure due to changes in altitude. This is not normally a problem with common chlorinated tap water in the tank. However, the purified water could now be susceptible as it is exposed to the possible entry of bacterial contaminants. These bacteria could multiply with no chlorine as a combatant. Would we now need to add another gadget?...(A) An ultra violet bacteria eliminator beneath the water tap...or...(B) Should the pure water be re-chlorinated before storage then pass throughl a final polishing filter beneath the water tap to remove the undesirable chlorine odor and taste again before consumption? (C) Some other solution that I ave not considered here?
All of the above considerations could of course, be exacerbated if the purified, non-chlorinated water is stored for an extended period of time.
Am I overstating the possibility of contamination? All of this is based on my own limited experience and knowledge. Do you know if anyone done any scientific studies on this?

So wadayathink?

Daron Hairabedian, 98 Allure, #30226
PS: This information with a few pictures sounds like it could become a highly specialized "how-to" book. Heck,...I would buy it!