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Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Yahoo Message Number: 72051
Anyone,

What is the normal engine and transmission temperatures for those of you that have a Cummins 400 ISL? Whenever I am running at highway speeds (55 mph to 65 mph) the engine temperature is between 200 and 213 degrees and the transmission temperature is about the same. The outside ambient temperatures have been between 85 and 95. We just picked this coach up on May 20, 201l and I am still learning its particulars. At some point in the near future I want to have the engine coolant replaced, flushed and a new coolant filter installed and I plan on having the same performed on the Allison 3000 MH transmission.
The previous American Coach we had contained a Cummins 350 ISC 8.3 and its engine temperature never soared above 200 and transmission temperature stayed below 190. Thanks for any feedbck.

Tom

'04 CC Intrigue
Maryland

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72052
Quote
Quote from: ThomasS"

Tom,

Those temps seem somewhat high for highway running at 55-65. Having said that; where are you reading those temps? If from the dash gauges I would question their accuracy. If from Silverleaf I would suggest changing the engine thermostat. To my knowledge the only thermostat for the ISL is a 180 degree. I have changed mine twice. Once due to very high temps and secondly because I didn't think the replacement was ever closing as my temps were very low. I just completed a 2800 mile trip whereby the temps generally ran around 180, even on very hot days. Twice on climbs the temp ran up to 200 but dropped back fairly quickly. Cummins says this is the normal operating temp. Others will argue that you should run in the upper 190s and if much lower they suggest the fan is running a too high a speed thus robbing you of mileage since the fan controller pulls up to 45 hp. On my recent trip my portal to portal average mpg was 8.6 and I am pulling a pretty heavy toad. With that mileage I don't think my fan controller is running high speed.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

Anyone,
> What is the normal engine and transmission temperatures for those of you that have a Cummins 400 ISL? Whenever I am running at highway speeds (55 mph to 65 mph) the engine temperature is between 200 and 213 degrees and the transmission temperature is about the same. The outside ambient temperatures have been between 85 and 95. We just picked this coach up on May 20, 201l and I am still learning its particulars. At some point in the near future I want to have the engine coolant replaced, flushed and a new coolant filter installed and I plan on having the same performed on the Allison 3000 MH transmission.
> The previous American Coach we had contained a Cummins 350 ISC 8.3 and its engine temperature never soared above 200 and transmission temperature stayed below 190. Thanks for any feedbck.

Tom

'04 CC Intrigue
Maryland

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72054
Lyle,

I'm reading from the dash gauges. I plan on taking a trip this weekend, without a toad, into the mountains of Pennsylvania to see what happens further. I will eventually transition to some version of a Silverleaf System; however, in the meantime, I need to address this high temperature issue. It has not overheated yet but I do not want to experience it especially on a hot and humid day. I'll need to schedule to take it in to a local Cummins facility to have the coolant drained, flushed and replaced and a new thermostat installed. We'll see if that corrects the problem.

Tom

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72064
Tom,

Mine runs between 198 - 204F reported by the SilverLeaf. When I park it and idle the engine, I'll see 178 - 180F. I've got the advertising flap removed. Trans temps run 212 - 224F. (SilverLeaf reading) I try to climb steep hills at 800 FtLbs and close to 1500 RPM. I adjust the transmission to get those readings. Seems to work well. I haven't a clue what the deal is with my thermostat. I'm running new coolant and a reasonably new radiator. No coolant filter. My bus is a different year and model from yours which might influence things. Hope this helps.

At 05:19 AM 6/20/2011, you wrote:

Quote
>

Anyone,

What is the normal engine and transmission >temperatures for those of you that have a >Cummins 400 ISL? Whenever I am running at >highway speeds (55 mph to 65 mph) the engine >temperature is between 200 and 213 degrees and >the transmission temperature is about the same.
The outside ambient temperatures have been >between 85 and 95. We just picked this coach up >on May 20, 201l and I am still learning its >particulars. At some point in the near future I >want to have the engine coolant replaced, >flushed and a new coolant filter installed and I >plan on having the same performed on the Allison 3000 MH transmission.

The previous American Coach we had contained a >Cummins 350 ISC 8.3 and its engine temperature >never soared above 200 and transmission >temperature stayed below 190. Thanks for any feedbck.

Tom

04 CC Intrigue
Maryland

Best - Scott

2006 Allure 430 #31349
(Bus-Stead Lemon)

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72065
Quote
Quote from: Scott
Scott,

I'm going to stick my neck our here and suggest that either your thermostat is not opening all the way (or soon enough) or that both you and Tom may have a fan operating issue. Others may chime in here but I think 212 is too high for normal trans operating temp. Usually the trans temp will be a bit below the coolant temp. Also, if you are running coolant at 204 on the flats and you climb a long, steep grade I would expect operating temps to exceed acceptable limits. This opinion is subject to comment, and disagreement, by others more knowledgeable than me.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue,

Las Cruces, NM (hot country)

Tom,

Mine runs between 198 - 204F reported by > the SilverLeaf. When I park it and idle the > engine, I'll see 178 - 180F. I've got the > advert

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72074
Lyle I know we have the same version of the ISL. Cummins told me mine should run around 195 where

the thermostat is supposed to open and the Fan should go to high speed at or around 205. Some of the

later engines that have the super high pressure rail or the DPF filter run almost 5 degrees warmer in

some instances. Now that I have the new radiator and fan controller, the engine and transmission run

cooler going up a moderate grade than on the level, just like when new.
Its only when I get down into

4th gear or third gear that the temps rise. Maybe 204. When the fan controller was acting up we

approached 210 a couple of times. Then it went to full on and I was lucky to get to 175. The tranny

seems to follow the engine with in 10 degrees unless in drive on a hot day standing still. I switch to

neutral when the tranny approaches 230 degrees on the dash gauge.
TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731

Original Message:
-----------------

From: Lyle lylewet@... Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2011 19:37:01 -0000 To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72076
Lyle,

I appreciate your input. No emotional outbursts from me on these subjects, issues and suggestions. I've already had the fan issue and was able to pull off the road and pull the plug. Since I reconnected it back in October, I've not had any problems. Not sure what gives with that. My engine warms a bit to 204F on the really tough climbs but has yet to go beyond that temperature. I have no idea about the thermostat and your assumption of it not opening all the way is perfectly reasonable. Does anyone have an idea where it's located in the engine and if it's a difficult item to service.

I have no idea why the trans temps are where they are. I've got synthetic fluid in it. I too agree it's a bit high but when I've broached this issue some agree and others do not. That's why I was hoping several other Allure owners might jump in here with data. Thanks for your input. This news group of combined experiences is very helpful to us all. Especially given the problems we all are dealing with trying to keep our busses on the road and running safely.

At 12:37 PM 6/20/2011, you wrote:

Quote
>

In

Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com, >Scott wrote:
Scott,

I'm going to stick my neck our here and suggest >that either your thermostat is not opening all >the way (or soon enough) or that both you and >Tom may have a fan operating issue. Others may >chime in here but I think 212 is too high for >normal trans operating temp. Usually the trans >temp will be a bit below the coolant temp. Also, >if you are running coolant at 204 on the flats >and you climb a long, steep grade I would expect >operating temps to exceed acceptable limits.
This opinion is subject to comment, and >disagreement, by others more knowledgeable than me.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue,

Las Cruces, NM (hot country)
>

> Tom,
>

> Mine runs between 198 - 204F reported by > > the SilverLeaf. When I park it and idle the > > engine, I'll see 178 - 180F. I've got the > > advert

Best - Scott

2006 Allure 430 #31349
(Bus-Stead Lemon)

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72077
Quote
Quote from: cmarshall@..."
Well, you make an interesting comment about what Cummins said. When I called them looking for a 190 thermostat they said there is no such thing for the ISL, only 180. This was confirmed by my local diesel shop. So, how does a 180 begin to open at 195? I would expect a 180 to begin opening at about 175 and be completely open at about 190.
As for Tom running only 204 on a grade, that makes sense if his fan is running on high all the time. He did not say what the issue was that made him "unplug" it but then he said he plugged it back in. I believe unplugging the two pin connector puts the fan in high speed at higher engine RPM. Tom needs to jump back in with some details.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740
> Lyle I know we have the same version of the ISL. Cummins told me mine > should run around 195 where

the thermostat is supposed to open and the Fan should go to high speed at > or around 205. Some of the

later engines that have the super high pressure rail or the DPF filter run > almost 5 degrees warmer in

some instances. Now that I have the new radiator and fan controller, the > engine and transmission run

cooler going up a moderate grade than on the level, just like when new.
Its only when I get down into

4th gear or third gear that the temps rise. Maybe 204. When the fan > controller was acting up we

approached 210 a couple of times. Then it went to full on and I was lucky > to get to 175. The tranny

seems to follow the engine with in 10 degrees unless in drive on a hot day > standing still. I switch to

neutral when the tranny approaches 230 degrees on the dash gauge. TWI > 2004 Intrigue 11731

Original Message:
-----------------

From: Lyle lylewet@...

Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2011 19:37:01 -0000 > To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission > Temperature

Quote from: Scott
Scott,

I'm going to stick my neck our here and suggest that either your thermostat > is not opening all the way

(or soon enough) or that both you and Tom may have a fan operating issue.
Others may chime in here

but I think 212 is too high for normal trans operating temp. Usually the > trans temp will be a bit below

the coolant temp. Also, if you are running coolant at 204 on the flats and > you climb a long, steep grade

I would expect operating temps to exceed acceptable limits. This opinion > is subject to comment, and

disagreement, by others more knowledgeable than me.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue,

Las Cruces, NM (hot country)
>

> Tom,
>

> Mine runs between 198 - 204F reported by > > the SilverLeaf. When I park it and idle the > > engine, I'll see 178 - 180F. I've got the > > advert

> mail2web LIVE ? Free email based on Microsoft® Exchange technology - >http://link.mail2web.com/LIVE >

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72079
Quote
Quote from: Scott
Scott,

Like in a car the thermostat is on top of the block where the large hose (2 1/2 in) attaches to the block. The thermostat is inside. Two bolts and a gasket. Easy change out although you will lose some coolant.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

Lyle,

I appreciate your input. No emotional > outbursts from me on these subjects, issues and > suggestions. I've already had the fan issue and > was able to pull off the road and pull the > plug. Since I reconnected it back in October, > I'

is perfectly reasonable. Does anyone have an > idea where it's located in the engine and if it's a difficult item to service.

>

>--- In

>Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com, > >Scott wrote:
>Scott,

>I'm going to stick my neck our here and suggest > >that either your thermostat is not opening all > >the

2006 Allure 430 #31349
(Bus-Stead Lemon)

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72092
Lyle,

Thanks for the clarifications. I'll look into this when I go into dry dock. Hoping sometime in September before hitting the road. Parked for 4 months at present. Today the van gets a radiator.

At 06:33 PM 6/20/2011, you wrote:

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72097
Tom,

I just replaced coolant & thermostat and run Transynd in transmission. On a run this past weekend in near 100 degree temperatures and in hilly terrain, the engine ran between 185 & 195 degrees--coach speed between 55 & 62 mph. The transmission consistently runs just below 200 degrees--usually between 194 & 198. My coach is relatively light, about 30,000 lbs and I tow a Toyota 4-runner. The readings are from my Silverleaf. I hope this helps.

Fred Compton

2002 Intrigue # 11407 w/ISL 400
 

Re: Cummins 400 ISL Engine and Transmission Temperature

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 72110
All,

Your responses have been helpful and informative. I will be taking the coach to Cummins in Glen Burnie, Maryland this Friday, 6/24 to have the thermostat changed only. I do not see the need to change the coolant and filter at this time; however, I will monitor this install to determine if there is a change in the engine temperature.
I plan on taking the coach to an Allison certified facility in Virginia within the next few weeks to have them to drain, flush and change the transmission fluid and to install a new tranny kit.
We'll see if these interim updates make a difference in the short term. Whew, there is always something with these beasts but we all must "pay to play."

Tom

'04 CC Intrigue
Maryland