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Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Yahoo Message Number: 84530
I hope someone can give me some advice

I have inconsistent loss of power in my 2005 Inspire Cat 400. ( 51406 ) My local Cat dealer indicated that it was a SPLIT AIR COOLER that needed replacement. Cost to replace is about 3500 dollars. First does this sound like this might be the problem ? Or do you have any other ideas ? Has anyone had a drop in power and replaced what ever this SPLIT AIR COOLER ? If so what did it cost.

Stan Canaris

2005 Inspire 51406

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84531
I've had to replace mine twice, once at 18 months and again at 9 years and Yes you will loose power. Fortunately for me, the leak was small enough the turbo was able to build enough pressure to stop any smoking and allow me to reach full power at full throttle. But because of the leak my mid rpm performance was miserable and I was loosing over a mile per gallon in fuel milage. I had three throttle positions, on, off, and petal to the metal. I made the mistake of contributing the milage loss to the new lower pollution diesel fuel. I have a new charge cooler I average closer to 9 mpg than the high 7 low 8's. And, I have a full range of throttle! $3500 SOUNDS ABOUT RIGHT. Make sure they check your radiator for leaks while they are at it, that's another area of concern. TWI 2004 INTRIGUE 11731

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84532
Stan,

I replaced our radiator and charge air cooler (CAC) at the same time as the CAC was tested and found to not hold pressure. The cost for both about 3-4 years ago was about $8,000. The cost for the CAC without labor was $1,200-1,500 with a lifetime warranty so with the labor, the $3,500 you've been quoted sounds about right. Our CAC came from a company in Canada but can't remember the name. Hope it all works out well for you and Brenda, Stan.

Mike Frederick
06 Inspire 51784

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84534
Stan,

If I understand correctly your power loss is intermittent. I would ask for an explanation of how it can sometime be okay and other times be down on power. Usually a bad CAC will just cause low power all the time.

Good luck Stan.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84535
Not familiar with your coach but on a Prevost i lost power and bought a new aftercare for big bucks when i took the bad one out the problem was the core broke loose from the end if had not already bought a new one i would have cleaned it good and repaired it with J B WELD It was welded original and radiator people say it cannot be re welded i do not understand i saw a auunium welder weld two cours cans together once. J B weld is good i had a ford tractor throw a rod once knocked a hole in the block replaced the rod repaired the hole with jb and put it back on the job. Wilmer
On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 12:55:26 -0800 Stan Canaris alepuzz@...> writes:

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84544
Stan --- is this related to the same loss of power you had some months back or is this a new issue?? jan

06 Intrigue

From: "wcg6@..."

To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 2:03 PM Subject: Re: [Country-Coach-Owners] Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Not familiar with your coach but on a Prevost i lost power and bought a new aftercare for big bucks when i took the bad one out the problem was the core broke loose from the end if had not already bought a new one i would have cleaned it good and repaired it with J B WELD It was welded original and radiator people say it cannot be re welded i do not understand i saw a auunium welder weld two cours cans together once. J B weld is good i had a ford tractor throw a rod once knocked a hole in the block replaced the rod repaired the hole with jb and put it back on the job. Wilmer
On Thu, 20 Dec 2012 12:55:26 -0800 Stan Canaris alepuzz@...> writes:

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84545
Rule of thumb (IMO) for loss of power is to change the fuel filters before doing anything else, which I'm sure you've already done.

Larry, 03 Allure 30856

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84578
Stan

I was having an inconsistent momentary loss in power when climbing and it turned out to be the fuel filters.

Dan 2006 Allure 31348 C-9

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84591
The charge air cooler is the radiator behind the ac condenser and in fromt of the radiator. Cost for a new one is $2000.00 including shipping. The new ones are called plate and bar and are heavy duty. Not to ban to replace if your handy. Im doing one now and installed today took about 3 hours. It took about 4 hours to get it out but i was detaing a lot of other stuff at the same time. Let me now if you need help or ideas.I did repair my old cooler if it would fit yours.

Rod
Inspire

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84593
Rod,

I have not fixed my unit. I was waiting until the first of the year. My mechanic said he thought he could fix the leak but I was hesitant, thinking I would be gambling and have to do it again. I spoke with Kevin and he told be to not purchase the one out of Canada but rather he would sell me one that is special made. What do you think of all, my options ?

Stan

2005 Inspire - 98,000 miles.
51406

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84595
Rod:

Where did you purchase? Can you give us some info on the procedure you used?

Gil B

'05 Inspire
51322

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84596
Thank You all for the information on the Split Air Cooler. I am gong to check on how to repair if this is the issue rather than the purchase of a new one. I wonder if your mileages are about the same as mine when the problem showed up, or is in strickly an isssue of 7 years old.

Stan 2005

Inspire 51406 --- 98,000 miles

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84597
Merry Christmas Stan, Did you ever get an engine warning light? It seems to me that the loss of turbo pressure through a cracked cac would show up as "low boost".
Can an expert chime in?
Jay

05 inspire 51457[ CAT

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84606
I purchased a new fully welded aluminum cac from Radiator Supply House in Sweet home Oregon and it was an exact replacment for the old unit. The new unit is called a bar and plate design so its not using tubes like a normal rad or cac. These are built for physacle abuse so may be irelevant in a coach. The cost was $1950 plus $50 for shipping. The old unit was a bolt on tank design so i took it apart and found a gasket with slots in it for the tubes. The gasket was leaking so i cleaned and retested and it didnt leak. I think if you have bolted tanks you may be leaking at this gasket. If the tanks are welded there may be cracks. The new unit came with a lifetime warany and i ask th guy about it and he said if it ever failed they would send a new unit and send the old one back in the box. Let me know if you want more details.

Rod

Inspire 51473

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84608
I can give some info on removal but since i took the entire system apart i will try to just list whats need for cac 1 remove 2 screws under door and raise (i removed since more stuff was comong out the hole.
2 Remove left and right sheet metal.
3 remove upper sheet metal. all sheet metal fastend with self taping screws.
4 remove right side panel in the bay next to rad.
5 drop air cleaner

6 lossen two 3 inch hoses to cac

7 remove 2 bolts on top and 2 bolts on botton of ac condenser.do not damage.swing the ac so it points stright away from coach.I was in a building so i used bungies to hold.
8 remove 4 bolts on plate between cac and hydraulic cooler.
9 remove 3 allen head fasteners on top.
10 the unit will now be loose.pull out a bit and slide to the left untill you can clear the door opening then slide out.
This is somewhat how i installed the new one. I pulled everything out as ones piece but decided to go back in seperate pieces because i wanted to test the rad befor i covered everything up.
Hope this helps someone.I have a few pictures and havnt put the door or side metal back on yet so i could get more if you need.

Rod

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84609
Stan

I guess the repair would depend on where it was failing. Mine failed at the tank gasket and after cleaning seemed to hold a pressure. My wife wanted the warantee and didnt want to be half way across the country and have a failure so i bought new.

Rod

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84612
ROD,

YOU HAVE GONE BEYOND HELP ----- THANK YOU

STAN

2005 INSPIRE

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84615
First of all, A Merry Christmas to all, and thanks for the great tips all year long.
Now, are he "Charge" air cooler, and the "Split" Air Cooler, the same thing? It (they) seem to be used interchangeably throughout this thread.

thanks,

Jim Hodges

2007 Inspire 360
#51969

"Peace is that brief, glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading". Anonymous --

Enjoy life NOW . . . it has an expiration date!

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84618
Has your Cat dealer pressurized the Air Cooler / Intercooler to test for a actual leak?
  • Test and determine where the leak is; it might have a small crack that can be welded
  • Try to determine what was the cause of the crack, many times it is the mounting brackets or rubber insulators have deteriorated causing the air cooler to bounce around while your driving.
  • There are shops that rebuild these air coolers at a 1/3rd the price of a new one.

Paul

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Coolezr ?

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84624
Hi Jim

I asume he meant your charge air cooler had a split in it causing it to leak. There is a term split air cooler but this refers to a air conditioning system that have the pump and condense outside and a air handler inside. You should double check but i am sure thats what he meant.

Rod
 

Re: Loss of Power Cat. 400 -- Split Air Cooler ?

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 84629
Feliz Navidad yAño Nuevo to all.

I now have a very stupid question. What does a Split Air Cooler have to do with 'Loss of Power'? Have I missed something in the previous emails?
Safe Travels and the very best to all for the coming year and the years in front of us.

Michael

05 Inspire #51381

**************************************** Michael Title

Halfmoon Bay, BC, Canada
CDN Cell: 604.741.3328

San Miguel De Allende, GTO Mexico MEX Cell: [52] 415.100.1543