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Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Yahoo Message Number: 99055
I have a 2003 allure.  The coach came with 3 large 8D wet batteries.  I need to replace.  Has anyone had any experience switching to gel Trojans?

Thanks
Bob

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99057
When we had to replace ours we went with Lifeline AGM and are very happy. No gassing or corroding and best of all no maintenance.
BVL

2003 Allure 1st Ave 30900

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99059
I have to second this opinion. We are almost five years into our Lifelines and have no reason to think they will need replacing any time soon.
Ken

2004 Allure 31035

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99060
I just replaced with NAPA at about $180 each.

Had Deka in last coach was not that impressed for added cost.

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99061
My first country coach had wet and at that time I could not see the value in gel and when it can time to replace I went with wet. My current coach has lifelines and after seeing some of the length of use folks are getting I think I have been converted. I will need to replace my current lifelines at some point and will go with lifeline gel. Hope this helps

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99062
My 2 original Dekas were installed in 10/06. Replaced them in 10/13 with identical model Dekas - 7 years of service. $490 total out the door. That was $70/year . . . I like that.

Maintenance is no big deal.

Lee (leozbrowski@...) President, CCI

2007 Country Coach Intrigue 12153
CAT C-13

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99063
My Dekas  first lasted about 6years.  Tried to replace them with Napa batteries, they lasted about 6 months  when they would only hold half a charge. I am now on my second set of Dekas which are about 3 years old.  TWI 2004 intrigue 11731

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99064
Gel is old technology. The new hot stuff is either AGM or Lithium . I installed Lifeline 8D's to replace the factory wets back in January of 2004. I am still running them and am now just beginning to see some degradation. When I replace, I don't know if I will go with Lifelines or another brand, it all depends on the specs.

Don

'02 Intrigue 11427
'02 Intrigue #11427

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99066
I would love to see some authoritative comment on what a service manager at an RV dealership told me... i.e. that wet cell batteries are not only much less expensive, they also last longer. I have no experience with it so I do not share this as my own opinion... it is just what I was told.  I went with wet cells for my 6 battery replacement. My coach has a pro-fill system from flow-rite.com which makes topping off your wet cells a 30 second exercise with absolutely no inconvenience involved. So there is little or no advantage in terms of convenience,  Now if AGM's would last longer in terms of overall life, or discharge more slowly when in use, or allow themselves to be discharged more extensively when running on batteries, those would be significant advantages, perhaps worth the expense. What documented opinions are there on these topics?

Joseph Burkle

2010 Tiffin Allegro Bus 43QRP

43' quad slide tag axle ISL 425 HP pusher
formerly:

2008 Country Coach Inspire 360 Founders Edition
Wind-seeker.com

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99068
I don't have any documents only my own personal experience over the past 30 years, with 3 different RV's.  And only the AGM's have ever lasted over 3 years  maintaining over 95% of their storage capability.  The longest was  7 and 1/2 years the shortest was the previous set at just a hair over 6 years.  Lead acids have been as short as 6 months with Napa's Heavy Duty  8D the longest being with 27 series in my Airstream TT, about 4 years, before the case cracked..  Sears sealed batteries in my Cars and Pickups gave the best performance over Interstate and others before K-mart got involved.  They usually lasted 6 years. with the last set in my Dodge Ram diesel lasting close to 8 years. Now I will admit the lack of sophistication of the charging system in the Allure and especially in the Airstream may have been a big issue in my favoring AGM batteries.  TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99082
I bought a new Beaver coach in 2003 which had Interstate wet cell batteries. The batteries had essentially died by 2006. They would only provide less than one half the original power before they were flat. So in 2006 I bought Lifeline AGM batteries. When I sold the coach in 2013, the AGMs were still working as well as they did on day one. My present coach has AGMs as will any coach I buy in the future (unless Lithium batteries become mainstream).

The AGM's take a charge faster, which means less generator time needed to recharge them, and they self-discharge at a rate of only 1-2% per month compared to something like 10-20% per month for wet cells. I have complete confidence in my AGMs, and I only look at them once or twice a year, just to make sure they are clean and secure. They never need water and do not corrode or spit acid on my battery compartment like my wet cells did.

I my opinion they are well worth the money.

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99088
We encountered the same problem this summer. Initially the coach would "buck" on a long pull up hills. As the fuel take became more depleted it got worse. We filled up the tank and then it wasn't as bad. It turned out that the fuel filter was clogged. We had only put a couple of thousand miles on since a new fuel filter. My guess is we pickup up a bad load of fuel. Kinda funny that we purchased the fuel in the Bakkan. (North Dakota oil area). After the new fuel filter all was good for the rest of our cross country trip.

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99089
I went over 24 years of driving diesels with out any fuel issues.  But in the last 4 years I have experienced bad fuel 5 times between the coach and my diesel pick-up.  3 of those times were from buying fuel at big trick stops,  Flying J and Petro and once from a Fred Myer fueling depot. .  The pick-up got polluted at a  Standard oil/Chevron station.  TWI  2004 Intrigue 11731

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99091
Gel vs AGM: Not Quite the Battle of the Ages, But Nice to Know

AGM Vs Gel Batteries Tutorial AGM (absorbed glass mat) is a special design glass mat designed to wick the battery electrolyte between the battery plates. AGM batteries contain only enough liquid to keep the mat wet with the electrolyte and if the battery is broken no free liquid is available to leak out.

Gel Cell batteries contain a silica type gel that the battery electrolyte is suspended in, this thick paste like material allows electrons to flow between plates but will not leak from the battery if the case is broken.

More often than not AGM Batteries are mistakenly identified as Gel Cell Batteries. Both batteries have similar traits; such as being non spillable, deep cycle, may be mounted in any position, low self discharge, safe for use in limited ventilation areas, and may be transported via Air or Ground safely without special handling.

AGM Batteries outsell Gel Cell by at least a 100 to 1. AGM is preferred when a high burst of amps may be required. In most cases recharge can be accomplished by using a good quality standard battery charger or engine alternator. The life expectancy; measured as cycle life or years remains excellent in most AGM batteries if the batteries are not discharged more than 60% between recharge. There are some AGM batteries we sell that offer excellent 80%+ deep cycle abilities.

Battery Tender Plus Gel ProfileGel Cell Batteries are typically a bit more costly and do not offer the same power capacity as do the same physical size AGM battery. The Gel Cell Battery excels in slow discharge rates and slightly higher ambient operating temperatures. One big issue with Gel Batteries that must be addressing is the GEL CHARGE PROFILE. Gel Cell Batteries must be recharged correctly or the battery will suffer premature failure. The battery charger being used to recharge the battery(s) must be designed or adjustable for Gel Cell Batteries. If you are using an alternator to recharge a true Gel Cell a special regulator must be installed.

Tim Fritz
2004 Inspire

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99092
Bob,

Switching to gel would probably require switching to a newer inverter/charger such as a magnum that has a setting for Gel batteries. The true benefit of gel batt's are the fact that you can dis-charge gel's down to zero volts, let them sit and they'll re-charge back to normal. That I would call a "pro", the con is the fact that they cost a bunch more and most coaches would also require an upgraded inverter/charger. I'm a fan of good quality AGM's, such as DEKA, Lifeline or Odyssey. Straight plate technology has come a long way in the last 20 years and in fact JCI (Johnson Controls) is in the process of switching over the optimum line from round plate to straight plate since now they can get over 20% more lead in the straight plate cases. Just remember you get what you pay for, and the heavier the battery (dry weight) the more lead they got in there and that will usally be confirmed by the 20ahr which will/should be more than the comparable with less weight/lead.  The most important things IMO when picking a battery is, weight, 20ahr & cost.

Jim

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99097
Gel cells do not work well in coaches. They do not like the  charge/discharge cycles. If they did coach makers would w=use them.

AGMs are the way to go if leaving wet cells.
 In the AGM category, Liflelines are a little more expensive, but worth it  over the DEKAs.

Mikee

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99122
Wow Thanks for all that information.  I guess the best is the Lifeline AGM /  Looks like $700 bucks each.  I  have 3 8D deep cycle.  I guess the coach uses them for start / Generator / and house, as I do not see any other batteries.
I am thinking $2,100 is not that bad since I have you all to thank. Im glad to hear some poeple got real positive experience with Lifeline AGM

Bob

03 Allure 3 Slide / Tag  #30814

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99135
Be prepared to deal with batteries weighing about 150 lbs a pop!Coriwelsh12314 Intrigue
 

Re: Batteries. Should I switch to gel

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 99253
Our 04 Allure also has 3 8D's. Two for House and One for Chassis. I also worked with Tom, and picked up my Lifeline's in California. Tom is a true professional, and gent, to work with.

We ended up with:

- X's 1 8D CAT Maintenance Free battery for Chassis. (At a recommendation from this board, as it had a great CCA value. And, with Tom agreeing it was a good way to go.)

- X's 4 Lifeline L16's AGM's, for a total 800AH. (They fit in the same foot print as the two 8D's. and we had the head room in the cabinet. (I looked closely at going with what Dallas did a few years earlier, and shuffling the battery and inverter/charger cabinet around enough to fit in X's 5 Lifeline 8D's for 1000AH. But doing the math on our daily usage, and adding lots of what else contingency 800AH supports us very well.

We were shifting to a higher percentage of Boondocking, and the 800AH along with a high efficiency Solar Panel system of 1200W - gave us the confidence that we were good to go for long hauls:)!

Are Lifeline's the best? Well, they do a great job, and have a good reputation. Rolls also has a good battery, if you've never checked them out. Be aware, that the Lifeline AGM charging setting is different then other AGM batteries. The setting on the older chargers, are set to the more generic charge parameters for other AGM's. We changed over to MS2812 PSW at the same time (Missed the Magnum hybrid by a few months!), and it has two different AGM default settings. One for Lifeline, and one for all of the rest.

(Lifeline give great info over the phone, and Tom is on top of his game too. They can give you an opinion on if the standard AGM charging settings for 'other' AGM's would have any major impact on Lifeline's. My perception is if you are going 'Park to Park' - it's not going to matter too much. If your current charger/inverter does not have a Battery Temp sensor included, see if you can add it, as it will help protect any AGM.

Best of luck to you. And not wrong or right on this, just options on how you use your coach - and how much you want to spend:)!

Smitty

04 Allure 31017
04 Allure Sold to a nice new owner! Now enjoying a 07 Magna Rembrandt 45' ISX600 #6775
"We're ONDROAD for THEJRNY!" (Toad and Coach license plates, say Hi if you see us!)