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Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #25 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55801
Hi T Boone,

I thing I see where you and I are talking apples and oranges. I now see that you are referring to the Energy Management System (EMS), a load sheding device when hooked up to 30 amp shore power. I am talking about the Progressive Industries EMS, a power surge protection device that is installed on the main power cord of the coach. A few years ago, a campground owner accidently opened up the neutral to a feeder sub panel. All the power posts feeding from that sub panel were involved. All the RV's using 50 amp service around me suffered a lot of damage. Our EMSHW50C shut down the incoming power to our coach. We suffered no damage including the unit.

Chuck & Mary B

Las Vegas, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #26 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55802
Hi Dave,

You make reference to residential applications. Check the code Book for RV applications. The key word is referencing. Is the service referenced to neutral, or to ground?

Chuck & Mary B

Las Vegas, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #27 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55804
Quote
I thing I see where you and I are talking apples and oranges. I now see >that you are referring to the Energy Management System (EMS), a load >sheding >device when hooked up to 30 amp shore power. I am talking about >the Progressive Industries EMS, a power surge protection device that is >installed on >the main power cord of the coach. A few years ago, a >campground owner accidently opened up the neutral to a feeder sub panel.
All the power posts >feeding from that sub panel were involved. All the >RV's using 50 amp service around me suffered a lot of damage. Our EMSHW50C >shut down the >incoming power to our coach. We suffered no damage including >the unit.
As I understand the system, the EMSHW50C system uses *mechanical* relay(s) to connect

power to a coach. IF this is true, there is no way this *mechanical* relay(s) can respond fast

enough to disconnect power when a neutral opens up *after* the system is connected.

IMHO, you were very lucky and/or the problem happened slow enough so that the relays

had enough time to actuate. A typical 50-100 millisec(?) relay response time is more than enough

time to do mucho damage to all your favorite toys!

TF

(praying for a Brown Victory in Mass!!)

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #28 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55806
Chuck,

My reference to residential wiring was only to point out that the wiring configuration available at the power post in an RV park is the same as what 99% of the homes in this country have. The breaker panel in the coach is nothing more than a cord connected sub-panel. Same rules apply.
The original statement involved the question of damage that would occur during the split second it would take for the contactor to drop power to the coach in the event of a lost neutral, and the contention that there would suddenly and mysteriously be 240 volts applied to circuits that were previously 120 volts. Ain't gonna happen. I cannot envision any scenario where damage would be incurred because of overvoltage.
I'm NOT saying that there might not me a possible, theoretical, hypothetical 'what if' case where damage to electronic devices could occur in the absence of the neutral. It's hardly ever good to run without one, but as a practical matter, nothing bad will happen to 120 volt consuming devices in the time it takes for the contactor to open.

Dave Trotter
Intrigue 11215

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #29 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55809
Hi Dave,

I respect your master electrician's rating. I speak from experience. I was in a RV Park where the owner opened up the neutral coming from a sub panel going to the power posts on the street we were parked on. Our coach was saved because of our Progressive Industries unit. Our neighbor's, who were on 50 amp service, received a lot of damage. This was in the summer time in 90 degree heat with the airs running.

Chuck & Mary B

Las Vegas, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #30 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55816
What may I ask is the EMS you are all talking about (not the Progressive EMS). Sounds cool. I don't think I have one on my Magna. I would love something that would drop loads as needed. BTW, gentleman, you have outdone yourselves on technical discussions this time!

Rich 2002 Magna

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #31 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55817
Excuse me, but electrical Master or not, I saw what happens when you lose neutral. We had an intermittent neutral on the power line going to our bunkhouse. It blew every single light that was on (four of them)simultaneously. One circuit had a refrigerator on it, the lights were on the other.

Al Colby

2000 Intrigue 10979

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #32 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55847

TF

What would you use to produce a 'heavy load' before you connect the coach to a power receptical? Something that works like a battery tester could be a effective and handy device, albeit, it has potential to be somewhat dangerous in the hands of someone whom is being careless. e.g. plugging or unplugging it while is is on.

ddtuttle

aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443
 

Re: intermittent electrical problems

Reply #33 –
Yahoo Message Number: 55850
Quote
What would you use to produce a 'heavy load' before you connect the coach >to a power receptical?
Electric cube heater, hair dryer....etc....something that draws 1000Watts+.
TF