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Brake lights out

Yahoo Message Number: 101736
L and R brake lights not working, but center brake light is. Tow plug brake light working. The only thing I've done lately that could be related is wash down the air dryer. I saw a lot of wires going to the back overhead, but does not seem like a little water would hurt anything. It is exposed to the road anyway.

I have verified that there is no power to the L and R brake lights. Bulbs test good. Schematics show the brake lights coming off the "rear cap harness," and the center light and L and R lights don't appear to be interdependent.

Anyone seen this?

Thanks

George Harper
04 Allure
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101739
George,

It is possible that both your L and R brake light elements have burned out at the same time. Have you checked for that?

George in Birmingham
'03 magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101742
Hi George

I had an 06 Allure that had the same problem. If your bulbs are good remove the stop light bulb and look in the socket. On mine the white plastic was deformed and had yellow heat spots on it. The bulbs are feed by small brass strips on metal that overhead, which is probably caused by the lights being on for a long time due to the Jake Brake. If that is the problem contact me and I will tell you 2 ways to make the repair.

Steve Dailey
08 Magna

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101743
Thanks, Steve. In my case I am not getting power to the L and R brake bulb sockets. I have tested the wires to ground. I am getting power to the center brake light and to the tow plug. I spoke with a technician familiar with Country Coaches and he said while the center light is fed straight from the pedal switch, the side brake lights go through the steering column because of their relation to the turn signals. He suspects a problem in the steering column somewhere.

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101744
George

In your original post I understood that the plug to the toad was working. If that is the case the problem is not in the steering column. Did I read it wrong?

Steve
08 Magna

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101745
Do signal lights work? BTW the trailer plug should use the  same connections as the rear lights, i.e. a left and a right no common brake  wire. If you are measuring a "brake" pin that is electric brake signal not  lights.

Ray

They say wine improves  with age! As I enter my golden years, I say age improves with wine!  The Born  Loser

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101748
Ray, I see your point. I guess both the L and R brake lights and the same terminals on the tow plug go through the turn signal switch in the steering column. So, then why is the tow plug working and not the L and R brake lights?

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101749
Steve, you read it right. The center brake light and the tow plug are working. Of course this is a combined turn/brake system and that is what is on my tow car - as opposed to the separate system used on European and Japanese cars with an amber rear turn signal.

As I now understand it the brake lights circuit (except for the center light) goes through the turn signal switch. At this time I am wondering who made the steering column. Is it the Smart Wheel folks? I will have to get into the steering column to see where the brake circuit is not getting through. Maybe a bad turn signal switch?

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101750
Exactly which is why I don't think the column is the problem.  On most vehicles the tow harness splits off just before the chassis harness splits for right and left sides.

I would make sure the signal functions correctly at the plug. I assume they don't at the tail lights.

Also how did you check for voltage at the sockets?  Did you use socket for ground or a bare spot on chassis?

What you may have is a bad ground to sockets.

Ray O 
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Re: Brake lights out

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101752
George

Contact me via e-mail with a phone # or I will give you mine. I think this is a problem with the tail light circuit board in the light assembly. I will tell you how to check it.
If you have right and left turn at the rear of the coach the problem is not up front. fyrandwater@...

Steve
08 Magna

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101753
I believe that your problem is the PC board on the taillight. I had the same problem and discovered that a poor bulb connection, high resistance, burned the PC board. I went to the truck salvage yard and bought 2 Dodge Ram taillights for $25, The 06 Allure used a 2002-6 Dodge Ram taillight. I replaced the PC boards and applied a dielectric grease to the bulbs and have not had a problem in 8 years.

John Beach

06 Allure 31309

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101761
Ray, I hooked the tow vehicle to the coach tow plug. Brake, turn, and flashers work on the tow. Everything works on the coach except the L and R brake lights.

When I checked the brake light wires on the L and R I grounded the test light to the coach ground block. All functions had power except brake.

I guess I will have to buy a tone generator and see if I can trace the integrity of the brake light from the tail light fixture forward til I find where the wire fails. Since the tow brake lights work, I agree the problem is not likely in the turn signal switch.

Thanks for your help.

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101762
Steve, unfortunately I do not have the tail lights with the circuit board. That would have been an easy fix to replace those. Thanks.

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101763
Don't know if it helps, but had same problem with brake lights inop on my '04 Intrigue and replaced a fuse in the circuit board to get it to work. Sorry but it's been years since I did it so can't give specifics on fuse location. Circuit board is under an open cover plate near the fuel filter, etc. Good luck.

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101766
George. I would check and spray the connector that supplies the rear lites and the tow board Mine was close to the right tail lite  Bob 06 intrigue 12047

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101767
George,

I think Bob has you headed in the right direction. If your tow plug is working properly, that proves out your wiring and electrics from front to back. There is a Molex plug (red in my Magna) that is wrapped in wire loom and maybe some tape, on the right side of the engine bulkhead. That Molex plug has all the taillight functions going through it. With a little effort, once you locate that plug, you will find a mass of corrosion inside that plug or at least a bad pin and socket. Although you have a newer Allure, I am confident if you work back from the tow board or tow plug you will find the connector where the wiring splits from the front. That larger diameter loom has the connector either in or outside that loom.

Fred '01 Magna

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101770
Jeff, yes, that is the tow board. I checked all the fuses in there even though I think it would only effect the brake lights on the tow which are working.

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 101803
Fred, good to hear from you, and your tip that the Molex plug may be on the passenger side of the engine compartment does agree with what Bob said. Also, Ray's comment that the tow plug splits off BEFORE the L and R brake lights will also help me trace it down. If I have problems finding the Molex plug (what CC calls the "RC" plug" - rear cap plug, I will get a tone generator which will take me right to the break in the brake light wire. Looks like a fun toy I should have anyway. The problem now is I have run out of time - leaving for Shipshewana tomorrow.

This failure is recent and I always want to think the failure has a simple answer and probably something I did. The most recent thing I did was to change out the air dryer. Before doing that I spayed an alkaline degreaser in that area and hit a large round electrical plug. The plug is black plastic and big. It also is threaded, so it looks like it would unscrew to disconnect. It is located just behind the rear axle on the passenger side. I have to wonder if getting this plug wet may have caused the problem, but what you and Bob have said indicates that the RC plug may be much further aft near the engine compartment.

Thanks to everyone's help on this. I now have a plan for finding the problem when I get back from my trip.

George Harper
04 Allure 31093
Rome, GA
 

Re: Brake lights out

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 102071
Recently had erratic brake lights and was diagnosed as air brake switch near brake pedal. Anyone have an approximate cost for the brake switch.
The quoted $157.70 plus $32. for shipping seemed very high for that part or am I just out of touch with reality? Thanks in advance.
02 Allure 36' #30685
Tom & Valerie