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towing a Mercedes ML

Yahoo Message Number: 7803
Hi Sully

And we were told by both a local Mercedes dealer and Remco that, with a transmission cooler installed, the ML tows fine and probably even the transmission cooler isn't vital, but good insurance. And thus far, towing several time now over a few 1000 miles every thing has gone great with the exception of the braking problem directly related to the Brake Buddy. Like so many things were found in Raving over our years of enjoying the experience, it does depend up who you talk to.
I've learn my best approach is gather all the information/advice I can and then make my own best decision. That's what we've done with the Mercedes ML and I know we're not alone in towing this car.

Tom

Towing a Navigator!

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7804

Hello to all:

Being a "newbie" to all this RV Stuff I need to ask a question about towing a 2004 Navigator 2WD behind my Dynasty. I have been to the dealer and they are absolutely clueless about how to do this..... Any help would be GREATLY appreciated....
Happy New Year to all.... Lorene and I hope to meet some of you during our travels this year!

Thank in advance for the help!

Kevin Doukas

Packet Design Inc.

Regional Sales Manager, Midwest Region
1317 Hidden Meadow
McKinney, Texas 75070
972.529.2450 Office
214.282.1855 Mobile

www.packetdesign.com
kdoukas@...
Simplifying Route Analysis

Network Magazine Product of the Year

Re: Towing a Navigator!

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7806
Quote

From: "Kevin Doukas" kdoukas@...> > Date: 2003/12/27 Sat AM 10:42:06 EST > To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com> > Subject: [Country-Coach-Owners] Towing a Navigator! >

Hello to all:
> Being a "newbie" to all this RV Stuff I need to ask a question about > towing a 2004 Navigator 2WD behind my Dynasty. I have been to the dealer > and they are absolutely clueless about how to do this..... Any help > would be GREATLY appreciated....
> Happy New Year to all.... Lorene and I hope to meet some of you during > our travels this year!

Thank in advance for the help!

Kevin Doukas

Packet Design Inc.

Regional Sales Manager, Midwest Region > 1317 Hidden Meadow
McKinney, Texas 75070
972.529.2450 Office
214.282.1855 Mobile

www.packetdesign.com http://www.packetdesign.com/> >kdoukas@... > Simplifying Route Analysis

Network Magazine Product of the Year >

Re: Towing a Navigator!

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7808
From: "Kevin Doukas" kdoukas@...>

Quote
Being a "newbie" to all this RV Stuff I need to ask a question about > towing a 2004 Navigator 2WD behind my Dynasty. I have been to the dealer > and they are absolutely clueless about how to do this..... Any help > would be GREATLY appreciated.... (snip)
According to the Motorhome magazine website http://www.motorhomemagazine.com/dinghytowingguide/index.cfm the '03 Navigator isn't listed as towable; however the '04 may be different, therefore towable. Check the January issue of the magazine for the latest info. Also check with http://www.remcotowing.com
Dick (& Geri) Campagna
'98 36' Intrigue #10571
Mfd: 11/97

Re: Towing a Navigator!

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7809
Quote
> Being a "newbie" to all this RV Stuff I need to ask a question

about

Quote
towing a 2004 Navigator 2WD behind my Dynasty. I have been to

the dealer

Quote
and they are absolutely clueless about how to do this..... Any

help

Quote
would be GREATLY appreciated.... (snip) >

According to the Motorhome magazine website >http://www.motorhomemagazine.com/dinghytowingguide/index.cfm > the '03 Navigator isn't listed as towable; however the '04 may be

different,

Quote
therefore towable. Check the January issue of the magazine for

the latest

Quote
info.
I think you will find that a 2 wheel drive 2004 Navigator will not be flat-towable without a drive-line disconnect. Check REMCO for drive-line disconnect information. Most of the larger size SUV type vehicles (GMC, FORD, DODGE) that are not 4 wheel drive are probably not going to be flat-towable without the drive line disconnect OR a transmission fluid pump also from REMCO. If you have a 4 wheel drive unit with a "neutral" selectable position it is usually towable with all 4 wheels down by just swithcing the transfer case into "neutral" position.

Bill-CC-Prevost XL 40' 1998

Re: Towing

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7812
I currently tow an Olds Alero--a little under 3,000 pounds. I would love to have an Chevy Avalanche which is shown as 5,600 pounds. How much difference would I notice with a change like this? I had about decided on a Trail Blazer or Envoy (4,500 to 5,000 pounds), but have not driven either one.
Really have the bug for a new vehicle, but trying to resist the urge for a while. I had to put new tires on the Alero just a few months ago.

Ree

Full-Timin' 2003 Allure 30852 Currently in Victoria, Texas
Home is www.eldoradoranch.com near www.sanfelipe.com.mx

Re: Towing

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7819
I have to cringe every time I see and hear motorhome owners talk about towing a heavy vehicle. I am not a big fan of 4000 pound plus vehicles to begin with, unless there is a specific functional need.
I am especially concerned when heavy vehicles are slapped on the back of a motorhome. While all those pounds sit on the vehicles own wheels when standing still, they are the burden of the motorhome when traveling at 65 miles per hour down the highway. While toad brakes can handle much of the burden of stopping the rig, it is not the best solution. In another post someone is talking about towing a Navigator ? ouch! I think he would find that with a loaded coach and a Navigator they would be over the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) for the coach. It just doesn't make sense to push or exceed these limits ? it is unsafe and wearing on the equipment.

Arthur Block

2002 Intrigue #11332
1999 Chevy Metro Toad

Re: Towing

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7820
I tow a yukon, no problem. rolling resistance is very small until hills

john

afinityy 2003

Re: Towing

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7821
--- In Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com, "artblocknj" w= rote:

Quote
I have to cringe every time I see and hear motorhome owners talk > about towing a heavy vehicle. I am not a big fan of 4000 pound plus > vehicles to begin with, unless there is a specific functional need.
I am especially concerned when heavy vehicles are slapped on the > back of a motorhome. While all those pounds sit on the vehicles own > wheels when standing still, they are the burden of the motorhome > when traveling at 65 miles per hour down the highway. While toad > brakes can handle much of the burden of stopping the rig, it is not > the best solution. In another post someone is talking about towing a > Navigator ? ouch! I think he would find that with a loaded coach and > a Navigator they would be over the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating > (GVWR) for the coach. It just doesn't make sense to push or exceed > these limits ? it is unsafe and wearing on the equipment.

Arthur Block

2002 Intrigue #11332
1999 Chevy Metro Toad
Not at all art! The 2003 coaches came with a 10K hitch capacity. Im posit= ive that CC wouldnt put a hitch on that would allow ( numerically) for you to go over their GCVWR... Of course toad brakes are a= DEFINATE...but as far as actual overloading goes...naw!!

Re: Towing a Navigator!

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7822
Quote from: bikerbill44"
> > Being a "newbie" to all this RV Stuff I need to ask a question > about

> > towing a 2004 Navigator 2WD behind my Dynasty. I have been to > the dealer

> > and they are absolutely clueless about how to do this..... Any > help

> > would be GREATLY appreciated.... (snip) > >

> According to the Motorhome magazine website > >http://www.motorhomemagazine.com/dinghytowingguide/index.cfm > > the '03 Navigator isn't listed as towable; however the '04 may be > different,

> therefore towable. Check the January issue of the magazine for > the latest
> info.

I think you will find that a 2 wheel drive 2004 Navigator will not > be flat-towable without a drive-line disconnect. Check REMCO for > drive-line disconnect information. Most of the larger size SUV type > vehicles (GMC, FORD, DODGE) that are not 4 wheel drive are probably > not going to be flat-towable without the drive line disconnect OR a > transmission fluid pump also from REMCO. If you have a 4 wheel > drive unit with a "neutral" selectable position it is usually > towable with all 4 wheels down by just swithcing the transfer case > into "neutral" position.

Bill-CC-Prevost XL 40' 1998
Correct! If it doesnt have an actual "neutral" position in the transfer box....expect a real PITA to pull it "4 down"

Sully

2000 Allure 36 ft

Re: Towing

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7823
The numbers don't always add up. The capacity of the hitch is exactly what it says. It is only what the hitch is capable of - NOT THE WHOLE COACH GVWR.

For example, in my breaker panel in my motorhome, the individual breakers add up to 80 amps, but I only have 50 amp service. You need to look at the whole picture.

My other point is that even when you are within the specifications, it is best not to push limits when not necessary. It is better to tow a 2500 lb vehicle than a 5000 lb vehicle - they will both do a good job as a toad vehicle, but the 5000 lb will stress your rig and lower your gas milage more than the 2500 lb. This all assumes that you have a choice of toad vehicles to use.

Regards,
Arthur Block

Quote from: rvman4u
-

Re: Towing

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7824

Arthur:

Yes, I agree with you that you should never tax the capacity of the coach, however, when I'm toeing my trailer w/ a Ferrari 550 Marenello inside the trailer we will be approaching 7500 lbs. which is well within the coach and the limits of the towing capacity.
As for the Navigator it is what we have today and it weighs less than the trailer and Ferrari combination, so, if this does not work we purchased a coach with the WRONG set of needs. while we plan to vacation in the coach it was also purchased for me to take my Ferrari to club track events allowing us a nice comfortable place to relax between racing the Ferrari. I sure hope that I have made the right choice with a coach! I know that several of my friends are currently using Monaco, CC, and Prevost Coaches for this venue....

THANKS for the help and support to us "newbies"

Kevin and Lorene Doukas
McKinney TX

Re: Towing

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7825
From: "Kevin Doukas" kdoukas@...>

Quote
Arthur:

Yes, I agree with you that you should never tax the capacity of the > coach, however, when I'm toeing my trailer w/ a Ferrari 550 Marenello > inside the trailer we will be approaching 7500 lbs. which is well within > the coach and the limits of the towing capacity. (snip)
I think the point that almost everyone makes is that, although you can tow up to "X" pounds with a coach, there's no doubt that towing less than that weight (or traveling below GVWR) provides a safety and mechanical longevity factor that's attractive to many; i.e., the more weight you tow ... the more your wallet will be low .

Sort've like knowing that racing your Maranello will result in increased maintenance and operating costs, eh?
Of course, if you don't use either much, they'll last "forever" (but not really). But that's no fun.

Dick (& Geri) Campagna
'98 36' Intrigue #10571
Mfd: 11/97

Re: Towing

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7831
Quote
I have to cringe every time I see and hear motorhome owners talk > about towing a heavy vehicle. I am not a big fan of 4000 pound

plus

Quote
I am especially concerned when heavy vehicles are slapped on the > back of a motorhome. > Navigator ? ouch! I think he would find
that with a loaded coach and

Quote
a Navigator they would be over the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating > (GVWR) for the coach. It just doesn't make sense to push or

exceed

Quote
these limits ? it is unsafe and wearing on the equipment.
Art, I hear you "but I ain't listening." My Prevost does not have a GVWR like other motorhomes have since it is actually a bus to begin with. It does have a 10K pound rating on the receiver and you can order them with a 20K receiver if you wish for large trailers, etc.
And when I pull my pickup with my Harley in the end the toad is over 7500#+. I use a brake system with break-a-way also. Prevost does not even know the load is back there. Mileage only affected by about 1/2 mpg east of the Rockies when pulling that heavy of a load.
Bill-CC Prevost XL 40' 1998

Re: Towing

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7832
Quote from: bikerbill44
> I have to cringe every time I see and hear motorhome owners talk > > about towing a heavy vehicle. I am not a big fan of 4000 pound > plus

> I am especially concerned when heavy vehicles are slapped on the > > back of a motorhome. > Navigator ? ouch! I think he would find > that with a loaded coach and

> a Navigator they would be over the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating > > (GVWR) for the coach. It just doesn't make sense to push or > exceed

> these limits ? it is unsafe and wearing on the equipment.
>

Art, I hear you "but I ain't listening." My Prevost does not have

a

Quote
GVWR like other motorhomes have since it is actually a bus to

begin

Quote
with. It does have a 10K pound rating on the receiver and you can > order them with a 20K receiver if you wish for large trailers,

etc.

Quote
And when I pull my pickup with my Harley in the end the toad is

over

Quote
7500#+. I use a brake system with break-a-way also. Prevost does

not

Quote
even know the load is back there. Mileage only affected by about

1/2

Quote
mpg east of the Rockies when pulling that heavy of a load.
Bill-CC Prevost XL 40' 1998

Bill,

Well .... if its a Prevost -- never mind!!

Happy towing,
Arthur Block

2002 Intrigue #11332

Re: Towing

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7833
My Alero is just not comfortable for traveling and not large enough to carry "stuff" when traveling in it, especially if others are with me. Also, I feel much safer in a larger vehicle. Several years ago I was driving a pick-up and hit a deer. It did some damage to the truck, but would have REALLY done damage to a small car. Said that I never wanted a small vehicle after that, but ended up getting the little car anyway.
I feel that the MH can safely tow a heavier vehicle, but just wondered how much difference I would notice.

Ree

Full-Timin' 2003 Allure 30852 Currently in Victoria, Texas
Home is www.eldoradoranch.com near www.sanfelipe.com.mx

Re: Towing

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7835

Dick:

Oh so right! where's the fun in having toys if you can't use them!!!!!??????!!!!! The Navigator is the vehicle that we currently own when we purchased our coach. Once we can justify trading the Navigator for a "smaller" SUV like a Jeep Grand Cherokee or Liberty we will do so, our problem is that with the depreciation that these vehicles take (Navigator) it will be a while before we can financially make that move, Bad planning on our part! Should have purchased the coach FIRST....

Thanks for the help and support!

Kevin Doukas

Packet Design Inc.

Regional Sales Manager, Midwest Region
1317 Hidden Meadow
McKinney, Texas 75070
972.529.2450 Office
214.282.1855 Mobile

www.packetdesign.com
kdoukas@...
Simplifying Route Analysis

Network Magazine Product of the Year

Re: Towing

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 7836
Ree,

The difference between a 2500 lb car and a 4500 lb car is 2000 lbs. I don't mean to be pedantic, but 2000 lbs is not inconsequential, especially barreling down the road at 70 mph. Many will tell you that they can't tell if a toad is behind their coach or not - therefore how much effect can it be having? The kinetic energy of a toad is enormous and the effort to stop it is also enormous. Yes your motorcoach can do the job, but it costs, especially when you consider the number of times you execute this stopping maneouver (and what about the energy to bring it back up to 70mpg). Towing a lightweight car is a significant advantage over a heavyweight, but there are compromises in terms of comfort and maybe safety. Often we end up using a car that was not selected for towing, but if you have the opportunity to trade or buy a new vehicle I would go for the lightweight.

Regards,
Arthur Block