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Over cooling

Yahoo Message Number: 103378
My 04 Intrigue with ISL 400 is over cooling when the dash air is on. Without the air it goes up to 190's and stays there. I think that means that the thermostats and controller are working and it my be the sensor on the air dryer. If I pull the sensor is there a check valve so I do not loose Freon. Any Ideas?

Lowell Johnson
#11725

Re: Over cooling

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103382
Thanks Mikee but for 10 years the temp. even with the air on would run in the 190's. With the air on now it runs in the 170's.

Thanks Lowell

Re: Over cooling

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103384
Yes the thermostat should be regulating the water flow to keep temp constant.

Ray O 
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Re: Over cooling

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103388
Mikey,

I think you're mistaken. The trinary switch on the high side of the system is controlling the cooling fan speed up and down as required based on head pressure.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Over cooling

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103389
I believe Mikey is correct at any time the over the road AC is turned on the fan speeds up, I know mine does.

Walt

2004 Inspire

Re: Over cooling

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103390
It is not correct that the fan is designed come on with the air conditioner on any CC I have ever owned or seen. That is because they come equipped with a trinary switch in the high pressure side of the system.

The purpose of a trinary switch is twofold.
 
  • Control the compressor clutch to run between excessive high side pressure(about 405 PSI) and low pressure(about 30 pounds). This is a safety limit, system protection management process.
  • Control high side system pressures in an efficient range by sending a fan start signal at about 255 PSI. This is normal operating procedure.
CC may have installed some of these systems with a binary switch which only performs the system protect function but I have yet to see one. The point of this is that if your system is working as designed the cooling fan will cycle based on A/C high side pressure inputs. Otherwise it has either been designed without a trinary, which you can determine by counting the wires on the switch located on the receiver drier, or it is not working properly.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Over cooling

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103393
George,

Thank you for your detailed explanation of how the trinary switch is supposed to work.
I have a 2005 CC Inspire. My fan switches to high whenever I engage the dash air conditioner as well.
I'm quite certain I did not have this issue in past years.
Can you tell me where my receiver drier is located? How many wires should I have if I have a trinary switch? If I have the switch, can you tell me what are the potential issues causing this, and how can I determine where the problem is.
This spring I added 1 lb of freon to my system as my low pressure side was reading about 18 psi. Could this have caused my problem? Thank you,
RJ

2005 CC Inspire #51264

Re: Over cooling

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103395
RJ,

The receiver/drier is located in the engine bay. It is generally a black, cylindrical device about 10" tall and 4" in diameter. It has two tubes exiting from the top. There should be 4 wires coming from the trinary switch which is a clearly visible potted device on the top of the drier.

Assuming, as I do, that you have a trinary switch it may have failed with the fan control portion closed. I really don't know how to trouble shoot the trinary but you may want to rap it with the handle end of a screw driver. That is my favorite repair method for just about anything. As an aside, the trinary is a very reliable device that seldom fails, though it does happen. Other than that I would have to take a look at my electrical schematic in order to determine my next diagnostic step. Sorry I don't know more than that.

It seems unlikely that you caused the problem by adding refrigerant though it is possible that you overcharged the system causing excessive pressure which could cause the fan to run on high. 30 PSI on the low side is not bad if the ambient is in the 70s and may not indicated an undercharged situation. The proper low side pressure increases with the ambient temperature. From memory, 30-35 is about right for 70 degrees ambient while 40-45 is good for 90 degrees. Most technicians today will put a thermometer in the output air and use that data to influence full charge determination. So, 18 PSI may have been a little low unless the ambient was pretty cool.

Someone asked if the trinary switch can be replaced without losing the system charge. No, I am unaware of any trinary that can be changed without evacuating the system.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Over cooling

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103399
Sure not trying to hijack this thread, and this is kind of related! We had a problem a few months back, that cleaning of the harness plug with electrical connector, seemed to take care of for now.

I'm down now for an appointment later this month Source Engineering to have our Fan Controller replaced with their replacement wax valve.

Anyone have any cautions on these? I know their not as sophisticated, but frankly, that is what I like about them:)! Opinions appreciated... And again, apology if this is too off topic from this thread...

Best to all,

Smitty

04 Allure 31017
04 Allure Sold to a nice new owner! Now enjoying a 07 Magna Rembrandt 45' ISX600 #6775
"We're ONDROAD for THEJRNY!" (Toad and Coach license plates, say Hi if you see us!)

Re: Over cooling

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103401
As I have said earlier, because the coach runs cooler with the wax valve, I figured my fuel milage would drop, but consistantly my fuel milage has increased.  I have to really be pulling a stiff grade in a higher gear in over 100 degree weather to get the temp qauge back to 190 degrees.  And have only gotten to 195 degrees twice, once climbing the grape vine  and once climbing I- 17  to Flag staff, both times with temps approaching 110 degrees  F.  TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731

Re: Over cooling

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103402
Hi Smitty.

I  bought a wax valve from Source Engineering and I installed it a year ago. I  had a little  problems and Scott from Source Engineering walked me though it and my MPG has gone up a little.  I'm a happy camper.

Jim

2006 42' Allure tag  #31936


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Re: Over cooling

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103404
Hi All,

I have a new to us 2005 Magna 40' with a CAT C13 - the fan controller needs replacing. Could somebody share the contact info for Source Engineering that makes the wax controller?

This forum really helped us get prepared to own one of these beautiful coaches.

Thank you!

/Mike

2005 CC Magna Matisse #6501

Re: Over cooling

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103409
Jim

Scott Zimmerman, Source engineering:  541-935-0308, email scott.z@...
I think you will like it.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

Re: Over cooling

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103414
Smitty we had the wax valve system installed last spring in Tucson by Premier before we left for Alaska. 10,000 miles on it now has it has performed well. My mileage has gone up .6 which is a plus. Temps stay around 183 - 186 unless going up long steep grades and then they can climb to the high 190's.

BVL

2003 36' Allure First Ave 30900

Re: Over cooling

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103415
What is a wax valve and what is it's function?  I have a problem with my 2003 intrigue overheating on mountain roads.
Glen coulter
2003 intrigue

On Tuesday, October 20, 2015 9:37 AM, "Bryan bvlandkvl2@... [Country-Coach-Owners]"  wrote:

Smitty we had the wax valve system installed last spring in Tucson by Premier before we left for Alaska. 10,000 miles on it now has it has performed well. My mileage has gone up .6 which is a plus. Temps stay around 183 - 186 unless going up long steep grades and then they can climb to the high 190's.

BVL

2003 36' Allure First Ave 30900

Re: Over cooling

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103416
A wax valve is a heat operated solenoid that directs hydraulic oil pressure to the fan motor which turns the fan.    It is what I had on my 98 Allure and never gave me a minutes notice.  Like you my 2004 intrigue came with the Sauer Danfoss electronically controlled unit that receives signals from sensors  to operate a solenoid that allows hydraulic fluid to operate the fan motor.  Later coaches receive signals from ECM of the motor  to an interface that operates the solenoid and doesn't need the external sensors.    As others have said the Scientific system unit has increased my  milage while lowering my operating temps about 10 degrees and kept the maximum way below the over 210 degrees I was experiencing.    TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731

Re: Over cooling

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103417
If the coolant temperature goes or stays below the thermostat fixed temperature, the thermostat(s) (Caterpillar calls them regulators) are defective and should be replaced.

Caterpillar recommends replacing them every two years.

Tim Gerrity
'02 Magna #6081
'11 Ford Escape

Re: Over cooling

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103428
We have had the Source Engineering wax valve on our ISL400 for 2+ years and it has worked great. We have no complaints. It keeps the coolant temp around 190 unless we are on a long hill in the heat of summer.

Norm

04 Intrigue 11773

Re: Over cooling

Reply #23 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103436
I also had wax valve installed last year in Tuscon at Premier and temp is running about 10 degrees cooler.  I had a problem before with overheating because the controler went bad.  I have a CAT C-9 and did have it reprogramed from variable speed fan to 12 volt on/off, which stopped theoverheating but it should not run that way.  The  wax valve  seems to be doing the job.

Dave

2005 Allure #31284
 

Re: Over cooling

Reply #24 –
Yahoo Message Number: 103455
I just got back from a 210 mile trip each way. I just looked at the replies and I do have a 4 wire sensor on the air dryer. I ran about 150 miles without the dash air on and the temp. would climb to the mid 190's and stay there. When I turned on the air it stayed in the mid 190's as it should. On my way back without air on again it stayed in the 190's, but with air on it dropped to the low 180's. I seem to have a intermittent problem. I will try the screw driver trick. Thanks for the feed back.

Lowell

#11725 400 ISL