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installing a real oven

Yahoo Message Number: 56452
Greetings,

I've been reading the posts from this group for over a year as part of my motorhome research and I have learned ALOT. So thanks. Now I have a question.
We are just a few weeks away from buying a motorhome and none of the ones were interested in come with a real oven. We don't want to get rid of the mircrowave oven, but we want a real oven. We plan to spend a substantial part of our time boondocking and a real oven is essential to the way we eat.
Most of the stovetops we see are recessed with corian all the way around. Here's my question: has anyone ever had their corian countertop cut away so an oven (which comes with a stovetop) could be installed? If so, where did you have it done and who did it?

Thanks for continuing my education,

Alex

close but not an owner yet

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56453

Hi Alex:

You don't state which model you are considering or the year. From at least 2004 CC installed GE Advantium Convection/Microwave oven combinations. It takes some getting up to speed time but we love ours and have seriously considered installing one in our home. It is a convection oven as well as a microwave and works quite well. The FMCA rallies have cooking classes specifically for this stove/oven. My bride loves it. I'm trying to sell you in it but explain what may be there and why yuo don't a "normal" oven.
If you desire a more conventional oven one could be installed but you would need to give up some storage space plus the cost could be high as they muist be installed in accordance with code for obvious reasons..

Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56454
Hi Bob,

When our daughter get married, Mary baked a three tiered two layers per tier heart shaped wedding cake in our Sharp microwave/convection oven one layer at a time. As Mary says, "its a peice of cake" to use our Sharp. As with a RV propane gas stove/oven, the only limitation to the Sharp is the size of pan that will fit.

Chuck & Mary B

Laughlin, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56459
Alex,

I assume you are referring to a home type electric oven. If so the concern would be how much power its going to take to run it. Most all ovens that I know of require at least 40 amps, most require 50 amps and some even require 60 amps. Assuming that you only have a 50 amp rated shore cord and breaker panel box even a 40 amp rated model oven wouldn't leave much power to run anything else while the oven is working. Just something to think about.

Terry

Quote from: guitarteachsail
>

Greetings,
> I've been reading the posts from this group for over a year as part of
my motorhome research and I have learned ALOT. So thanks. Now I have a question.

Quote
>

We are just a few weeks away from buying a motorhome and none of the
ones were interested in come with a real oven. We don't want to get rid of the mircrowave oven, but we want a real oven. We plan to spend a substantial part of our time boondocking and a real oven is essential to the way we eat.

Quote
>

Most of the stovetops we see are recessed with corian all the way
around. Here's my question: has anyone ever had their corian countertop cut away so an oven (which comes with a stovetop) could be installed? If so, where did you have it done and who did it?

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56467
We have been learning how to use the Convection Oven too, we like it so far but are no experts at it yet, still more to learn... One thing that I don't like is taking out the medal pan and putting it back again when using the MW.. I wondered if there was anything that would replace that medal pan that would not have to be removed each time..?? anybody tried anything different..?? Marvin, 07 Allure 470

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56469
Hi Terry,

The 40, 50, and 60 amp electric ovens use 240 VAC referenced to ground. The 50 amp service in a RV is 240 VAC referenced to neutral. One would need a special wiring electrical panel to run 240 VAC referenced to ground. Some coaches have a 240 VAC clothes dryer that is operational using a different switch box.

Chuck & Mary B

Laughlin, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Alex,

I assume you are referring to a home type electric oven. If so the concern would be how much power its going to take to run it. Most all ovens that I know of require at least 40 amps, most require 50 amps and some even require 60 amps. Assuming that you only have a 50 amp rated shore cord and breaker panel box even a 40 amp rated model oven wouldn't leave much power to run anything else while the oven is working. Just something to think about.

Terry

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56471
I thought the original post talked about dry camping, in which case, he needs a propane oven.
This is not too difficult to have done but as one person stated, whenever you get into propane modifications it's a good idea to have it done by a professional.
There are some very good propane combination oven/cooktops available. My guess is that the cost would be in the $3k range.

ROwen Inspire 51442

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56474

That metal pan is part of the cooking system, change it and it changes the cooking times and effects. If you get the chance attend one of the classes at an FMCA International rally - don't know if they give them at the regionals.
Having to wait for the oven to cool down before using the microwave is also a pain but is the price of having a dual cooking source system.

Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56479
Bob, I know that the metal pan is part of the baking function(method), but what does it accomplish other than just dispursing the heat evenly? Would something like a pizza stone do the same, Am I the only person that has a problem with the metal pan...if so I guess I will have to deal with it...I always like to be different!! Marvin

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56480

Actually, the present code requires a neutral to an electric oven. Although it does not matter, power wise, where the reference is to other than the 120v loads, like the light, now flow back to neutral instead of ground. (small load, however, ground is supposed to have flow only in the case of a short. In the case of a motor home being referenced to neutral, it is also referenced to ground. The difference between a motor home and a house is the neutral is not tied to ground until the pedestal and in a house the neutral and ground are tied in the panel. A RV is wired like a garage fed from a house panel.
As for the oven, I assume if he went with one he would use a gas oven rather than electric. Although you can buy 110 volt ovens, they are basicly the same as your convection oven and slow to heat or recover to temp. ddtuttle

aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443


From: C&M0529 To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sat, February 13, 2010 9:19:08 AM Subject: Re: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: installing a real oven

Hi Terry,

The 40, 50, and 60 amp electric ovens use 240 VAC referenced to ground. The 50 amp service in a RV is 240 VAC referenced to neutral. One would need a special wiring electrical panel to run 240 VAC referenced to ground. Some coaches have a 240 VAC clothes dryer that is operational using a different switch box.

Chuck & Mary B

Laughlin, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat



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Re: installing a real oven

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56484
I did this a couple of years ago, I will post a couple of pictures. Wife loves it.

Jack Allure 30076

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56486
Alex,

My wife attended cooking classes at 2 rally's for operation of the convection/ micro. She purchased some of the cookware and decided to give it a try. With some reservations she took on a roast. No bragging ....It was excellent.
With the classes came some comfort that a good chance of success would happen.
Hey... what happen to going out to eat ? We enjoy that and our rule is when we travel we never eat at the chain restaurant. Looking for that local flavor.
Another suggestion as you are probably looking for good places to eat. Get a latest edition of " Big Rigs" as they now have local restaurant tips at many of the suggested RV parks.
AL

00 affinity #5851

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56491

I _guess_ that you could use most anything that doesn't cause a fire or other hazard. But, any cooking instructions you read or come upon would almost certainly be affected by the change in materials and might make them worthless as a guide. So in theory you could change it and develop your own recipes for eveyrthing you want to cook in it. Seems like a lot of work and expense to replace a metal disk designed to work with the system.
The Advantium works very well for almost everything we have tried. I seem to recall the wife had some problems with a brownie recipe - but we're not supposed to eat that stuff anymore anyway. ;-) The grandkids are another matter of course.

Bob (rthandren@...)
'05 Inspire 51178

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56495
BILLY I believe you have it right A MH does not have 240 volts to neutral it has 240 volts between line 1 and line 2 if the pedistal is connected correctly It has 115 volts approx from the line 1 or 2 to neutral the ground is connected to the neutral in the pedistal BOB 06 Intrigue 12047

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56497
The neutral bus in the pedistal is isolated from the ground and the pedistal box.

Chuck & Mary B

Laughlin, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56498
Check out the wiring diagrams on page 21 thru 26 of the attached pdf file on the Murray RV Pedistals. All the neutral buses are insulated from the box and the ground.

Chuck & Mary B

Laughlin, NV

Shelby Dog, Miss Kitty, Mr Lucky Cat

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56500
Chuck,

What are you smoking?

240 VAC is across the 2 hot legs. Tell me how you can get a reading of 240 volts across any hot leg to neutral or ground from a typical 240 volt single phase service, using a 2 lead volt meter.

Mikee

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56501
Chuck,

Yes, they are isolated at any sub panel after the main disconnect, but if there are no opens in either circuit there is no difference in potential between them. The separation is to prevent any back feed of voltage on the ground leg in the case of an open neutral. The main purpose of the ground leg is to prevent any potential between the chassis or metal parts of any components connected in the service. The ground and neutral are tied together at the main disconnect.

Mikee

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56502
All this electrical education is interesting to say the least.. don't know what all this has to do with the OP, it said we do a lot of "Boondocking" I don't think they were talking about an electric stove. Think Propane!!! Marvin


From: "Mbaul@..." To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sun, February 14, 2010 8:00:56 AM Subject: Re: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: installing a real oven

Chuck,

What are you smoking?

240 VAC is across the 2 hot legs. Tell me how you can get a reading of 240 volts across any hot leg to neutral or ground from a typical 240 volt single phase service, using a 2 lead volt meter.

Mikee

In a message dated 2/13/2010 10:19:41 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, elmerfletcher@ yahoo.com writes:

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Re: installing a real oven

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56522

Marvin

izza stones or any kind of stoneware works great, you just have to allow for the additional time for the stones to get to temp.
Preheat the pizza stone, then throw the pizza on it. mmm mmm good

ddtuttle

aka Billy Byte (trusty hound)
2000 Allure #30443

installing a real oven

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56526
Alex and anyone else interested in installing an oven,
When we ordered our Allure I asked for an oven. I was told that I didn't need an oven because I could use the convection oven. I replied that we are southerners and we bake bisquits. We got our oven and still have enough spece under the oven to store all of our pots and pans. We have been fulltimers for nearly 11 years and spend at much as 4 months at a time without ever plugging into electricity. I often don't want to use the generator to run the convection oven for as long as it takes to heat it up and complete the baking, especially if it is a cake, etc. In the morning we can bake bisquits without disturbing our neighbors who might be sleeping later.
I have only one regret. I should have found out jmore about the ovens and ordered the next size larger. Otherwise, I love our gas oven.
Be certain that the oven is installed so that the top of the stove is no more than 1/2" below the level of the corian counter top. The edge of the counter top should be 2" from the outside edge of the stove and should overhang the width of a strip of corian. Both of these measurements are critical to allow maximum room for larger pots and pans being used at the same time. I have a three burner stove and there are many times when I have three pots/pans on the stove (and I use my microwave a lot too). The two inch space around the stove is filled in with a stips of corian that meets the strip of corian that goes up to the overhanging edge of the counter.

Any experienced corian installer should be able to do the job.

Enjoy your gas oven.

Gene Merryman

2000 Allure #30496

Re: installing a real oven

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 56533
Gene,

Thank you for taking the time to educated a newbie such as myself. I'm one of these guy that's been preparing for the fulltime lifestyle for 2 years now, studying, reading, archiving, and I have a lot of info in my head and stored on my computer, but my practical experience is basically nil. The info you just gave me is something I will save and pass along to the oven installer once we get to that point and then I will owe you a good stiff drink if/when we meet.

We are so excited about this next phase of our life, and yes, we plan to also spend 4-6 months 'off the grid' so to speak. I also don't want to run a generator and we plan on having 720 watts of solar feeding 8 6volt Trojan T105 (pretty sure that's the number) we we get our set up. We've met Robert Shearer (sometimes known as handbob or solarbob on the internet) who is advising us on the particulars of the solar installation. We would be curious to know what kind of set up you have.

My wife is also interested in knowing the size of oven you would prefer to own. Is it the 22" model you would like?

Thanks again so much for what you've given us already. There is nothing like the voice of experience...

Alex Peters

PS We fell in love with an 04 CC intrigue ovation 42' that sold on Ebay for 120K. Ouch, we just weren't ready. Now we're also liking the 05 Monaco Dynasty Diamond IV.