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Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questions f

Yahoo Message Number: 67802
I guess I need to provide a little more info. for you folks. Some of the suggestions are way out of my budget thank you though. To make a long story very short I am in western CO. They have driven gas jobs and construction out of my area. My commercial photography has tanked ( I do Construction and Oil and Gas Photography) Chevron is one of my clients and they backed out of 4 jobs on me due to money and the economy here. So I am working a part time retail and not making the morg. payment and burning through my savings. Only thing to due is sell the house and have a home that I can move to where jobs are when I need work. I am having to sell my house way below it's worth more than a 100,000.00. That will only net me about 125,000.00 after everything and selling the truck/ trailer and what I don't need will bring in another 35,00.00 or more I hope. That's it, what I have to play with so I am looking only to spend a 100,000.00 or less on what I find. Not really in most of you folks league in terms of income. What I am looking for is a a robust rig ( the one only will be able to buy) that I can boon dock with mostly. I also prospect so I am looking at staying at Lost Dutchman Ass. property's when doing that and picking up photo work when I can. I want is a rig that I can pull a car hauler with my Honda Element and a UTV to prospect with. Figure all together they will weigh about 7 to 8 grand. I have found a few 1998 to 2002 CC Intrigue around the 90,000.00 range and found some 2004 CC Inspire Genoa's. Where is that coach in quality compared with with the Intrigue and Allure? Will a 350 Cummins that is on most these coaches I am looking at pull what I have in mind? I don't want to go over 100,000.00 on a coach as I need money in the bank to live on. If I can't get a CC, then back up plan is a Monaco Windsor/Dynasty or a Safari Sahara. I know they are not built like a CC but they seem better made than most. Have any thoughts for what I am thinking coach wise? Once again thanks for your suggestions. Greg

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67805
May I suggest you set your sights a little higher? Look at CC Concept, Affinity or Magna from 1995 to 1999. They want be 45' or even 42' and want have 4 slides or a tag axel. These coaches were built when Bob Lee was at the controls and are of the highest quality and well within or below your price range. Don't shy away from them because of the asking price. A lot you find on the internet seem to be old listings.

Jim E

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67809

Jim when you say don't shy from asking price, am I looking a old prices not updated? What prices and add's are you looking at. I thought most of the late 90's where just one slide or two? What sites would recommend to look at for what you are writing about? Thanks for your reply, there a lot to look at and try to sort out. Greg

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67810
CC made about 10 2003 Intrigue 38' long with 2 or three slides. Its basically my 42' with a shorter kitchen and a smaller bathroom. It has 2 bays rather than 3, with the either the 370 or 400ISL. You might get a deal if you can find one because its not 40'. watch the Inspires and Allures of that period as the fiber glass has some nasty issues when painted with dark paint. TWI. You also want the new Allison 3000 trany as it is 15% more efficient than the older 3060 and 3060p. The ISL is more efficient than the ISC, too.

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67819
Greg,

It sounds as though you have given a lot of thought to your future plans, however, please allow me to offer some additional thought. Owning a diesel is not an inexpensive thing. Have you planned for an annual budget to cover maintenance, insurance, fuel, tires, etc. Not to scare you but things can and do go wrong. As an example a failed injector pump could run a couple of grand or more. I just spent that much on a failed fuel accumulator and warped exhaust manifold. Six new tires will push three grand. Insurance another grand. I don't want to rain on your parade but I do hope you have considered these things.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67822
Greg,

In a lot of cases you are looking at old posts. For example, the asking price may be $100K but the current market price would be $75K because the asking price was a couple of years ago. I think most dealers are selling consignment coaches and some trade ins. The only pricing guide lines for individuals selling a MH is the online NADA book. IMO, those prices are unrealistic. I would bet no one gets their asking price. Same for dealers. They always seem to be really high.
You are right, most mid to late '90s MHs had no slides. I have had both, with and without slides. I currently have a high line, SOB non slide model. We, 2 of us, get along very nicely with no slides. I want knock slides, they add a lot of floor space but also add cost and often times more problems. Look at a MH builder that offered a 40' with a slide and without one. You will see $25K to $30K difference. If you can live without a slide, a mid to late '90s, 40' CC Concept, Affinity or Magna can be bought for a song and, you will be getting one of the best production line coaches ever built.
There are a lot of web sights listing MHs for sale. Google "Motor Homes for sale". One really good sight is "OODLE. COM".

Hope this helps.

Jim E

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67826
Lyle,

I agree somewhat with you post. But I would never encourage anyone in Greg's situation to buy a gasoline powered coach. You didn't say that but it sounds like you are not thrilled with diesel. All the things you mention can also happen to a gas rig. Except maybe an injector pump. If you follow the posts on this forum and similar ones, you will notice that most problems occur with later model coaches, ie, around 2001 and newer. That's about the time MHs were selling faster than they produced them and consequently, quality, including fit and finish went down. New cheaper models where added to gain market share and satisfy customers that wanted a particular brand but could no afford the existing models. CC is a good example. In early 90's they produced the Concept, Affinity and Magna. Then came the less expensive intrigue, Allure and etc. Other manufacturers did the same thing.

Jim E

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67828
Jim,

You are correct, I did NOT say that! And, you are wrong, I love my Intrigue and it has been a great coach. My coach is my hobby and I spend a lot of time upgrading and taking care of it. (Tomorrow the new Samsung refrigerator goes in). I was only offering a word of caution that when things do go wrong they can sometimes be expensive and diesel pusher repairs are likely going to cost more than a gasoline engine. Case in point, compare the cost of an oil change. Greg sounded like he was on an economic margin that could hurt if he did not plan for expensive, unforeseen circumstances. There aren't many of us in this game that haven't been there/done that.
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67831
Lyle,

I don't want to continue this thread with off topic remarks. I'm sorry if I offended you but I fail to see where I was wrong. One last comment I think you will find that diesel engines in MH's have fewer problems than gasoline engines. True, an oil change cost's more. I see you have an '04 Intrigue. Have you ever had a problem with your engine?

Jim E

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67834
Things can go wrong on any gas or diesel powered motorhome that will challenge a tight budget.

One cost is relatively constant. Depreciation.
Depreciation will continue while your next rig is yours. My old 1995 rig has depreciated about $9,000 per year on average over the past 9 years per NADA.
If you are interested in a well built diesel, perhaps moving back a few years in vintage would reduce the purchase price and complexity of the purchase target and still have reliability.
An Intrigue, Magna, or Affinity from 1999 to 2001 would provide a durable chassis and house components if well cared for by the prior owners.
One salon slide would be very nice to have feature. More slides are merely wants, not needs. 38' would be a very flexible length for constant boon docking but length may be driven by the number of full time occupants.
A Cummins 8.3 ISC engine is a very durable engine and high mileage is not a factor except for wear on the House and engine accessories.
A Monaco Windsor or similar would also provide the same benefits, just not as much heft to the house components as CC seems to provide.
Your biggest cost to MH ownership is rapid depreciation followed by personal choices on fuel, camping fees, and repairs/maintenance (DIY vs hired out). Most shop labor is in excess of $100/hr.

Dean

95 Magna 5280

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67837
Just to second Dean's comment..

We found ourselves in a simular economic situation and traded our house for the motor coach as a way of both down sizing and keeping our options open for possible opportunities that might require travel.
We found a 38' Magna 1993 vintage for a very reasonable price.
the PO had done a number of upgrades ( tires batteries fridge and new tvs) I was pretty nervous the first couple months because I thought there would be something unforseen lurking around the corner. after having lived aboard for 4 months I've done a few repairs...
new ceiling vent in the bathroom, TP valve on the water heater, replaced the old thermostats with digital ones.
and we spent some money at the shop having all the fluids and filters changed, a couple air leaks fixed and a new set of shocks ( all for $1800) I really have to say if I had to do it all over again I don't think we could have made a better choice than this coach! She is put togeather very well and we believe will last us for as long as we care to be fulltimers.

-Paul Walker
'93 Magna #5058

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67845
Greg,

I am curious as to what makes you head toward a motor home. You mention selling the truck and trailer. What kind of truck and trailer. While I wouldn't dare mention it on this group there are alternatives to motor homes and about 50% of the fulltimers live very comfortably in them.

Don Seager

2004 Allure 31046

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67846
Don I have 99 350 Ford and a 33' Newmar pull trailer. I need more storage for photo equipment and be able to have a UTV. Cant pull a trailer with a pull trailer. Different needs now than when I bought the trailer. Grg

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67848
And I'll third the comment. Our '95 Magna has been super reliable and I have no fear of chassis problems that can't be fixed. It is a Gillig bus chassis and they are still in business. No slides, but that was a requirement as my age is getting to forbid me messing around with all the problems they bring with them with all the variety of systems that were used in them. Probably be selling it soon, but not quite yet.

Mike Cebula
'95 Magna 5266

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67849

Can't you do it if you have a Class A license. I know you can do it in Nevada as some friends of mine pull a boat behind their trailer.
Ilene 2004 Inspire 51071

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67851
I didn't think double towing was legal in any state.

George

'04 Inspire 51061

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67852
Most of the states if not all won't let you do it. A 5th wheel in some western states, I know CO here won't allow it. 5th wheels with a trailer in the west coast state's, they won't allow it nor BC if you want to go to AK. There is some web sites with State regs. on length and and what you can pull that go over it. If I remember right about a 12 states allow 5th wheels to pull a trailer behind it. I spent some time looking at toy haulers and 5th wheels and what I wanted to do and some the problems going that route. I made up my mind that a motor home had less problems and head aces for me with what I wanted to do for me. Greg

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67853
It is legal in most western states. Oregon, Washington it is not. Have seen it with California plates as long as the overall length is o.k. East it is a big No, No, at least that was the last information I had seen. Utah, Arizona, Nevada for sure. But those states also allow ATV on the streets. Some states are just more in tune with the times then others. Then there is Oregon who thinks they are above and better then any others. Ops. That is the (dumb) state I live in, (and getting very tired off the political climate.) Sorry just need to vent a bit. But still not something I would want to do if I wanted to full time and the freedom of taking it with me. We tow a 22' enclosed trailer to be able to take it along. Even then the try to avoid Calif. with there stupid 55 mph towing speed limit. Just amazes me, how much smarter I am in some states and how dumb in others, by there laws.

Grin, it is sunny and warm today. Almost spring fever weather. But.......more to come.

Leonard

97' Magna 5418

One thought for Greg, looking for used. The longer one has set unused, the more catch up maintenance it will need.

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67854

I do not know the rules in Oregon but to drive my CC and be legal I had to get a class B license in Nevada because it goes by weight. The state of Illinois has a rule at least it did a couple of years ago the every RV had to go 55 and it did not matter if you were towing anything.
Ilene 2004 Inspire 51071

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67855
In Oregon a driver's license is all needed. There was talk of changing it. As for Illinois, keep telling the wife, everything worth seeing is west of the Rockies. West of the Mississippi for sure. No desire to drive back east on my part. I have just to much fun enjoying the West. So much to see and then see it again. Love to dry camp and get in the back country. Ever changing and still way more states then we have begin to explore. Life is good.

Leonard 97' Magna 5418

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67856
Spent the summer looking at toy haulers and 5vr's. Problem you get into is weight with the 350 to 550 trucks. Everyone I talked to was putting chips and every thing under the sun to get them to pull the Rockie's. Then you have the size of brakes on the truck and no matter what the TV adds say ain't enough. My buddies wife barrel races full time and she got rid of the 350 and bought a 550 top Kick because the trailer was pushing her down the passes. The medium duty truck the better bet to semi's for the well made trailers with weight. Issue is the insurance for the medium duty, they generally won't cover it for daily driver for work. I spent some time looking into that angle and wasn't working for me. As I stated all things considered a motor home seems to work best for for what I want to do. Greg

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67857
Greg,

You have done your homework. But be aware. The brakes on a motorhome are just sufficient for them. The engine brake is what makes it work in the mountains. If you plan on towing, be sure you have brakes on what you tow and a very good brake control designed for RV and not pickups. I had to go with an air over electric trailer brake control to get good brakes on the trailer. The best rated all electrical control did not work for me. It is real easy to get hot front brakes coming down grade. Now it does not happen as before. If you plan on heavy towing, I would look for one with a Jacob's type brake not just the exhaust brake. But my exhaust does work very very well.

For better clarification. We tow our Jeep Wrangler bare foot and the brakes on the coach handle it fine. Put the Jeep in the 22' enclosed trailer, need the trailer brakes to work. No free lunch when working up and down those grades. But much prefer the diesel over the gas for that kind of work.

Leonard 97' Magna 5418

Re: Thanks for your reply's on buying a CC, I have some more questio

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67858
Greg,

We tow our '01 GMC pickup behind our Inspire. We have a Polaris RZR UTV that we put in the bed of the pickup. That way you don't have to tow a separate trailer.
Larry & Linda
'05 Inspire 51469

Re: Trailer and Exhaust Brakes

Reply #23 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67859
Not trying to rain on anybody's parade on this discussion, but there are factors which may or may not , make it necessary, to add air over electric brakes to make the combination work. The amount of exhaust brake available is based on the engine cubic inches. If you have 5.9 L ISC versus 14.9 L ISX , ( I don't know Cat sizes ) you will have much more exhaust brake available. At least , close to 3 times. Therefore , if you are looking at a coach with a small cubic inch engine, then enhancing your trailer brakes becomes necessary. We came down HWY 58 in Oregon, from Bend back to Eugene area in my Magna ISX 14.9 L engine on a 7% grade down. My wife hates this story, but the coach with fuel water and my wife's make-up weighs about 51,000 Lbs. towing a 25 ft trailer and Jeep at 9,000 Lbs, making 60,000 lbs, we only hadto hit the brakes 3 times, and was playing the Exhaust brake 3-2-1 , as necessary. If I knew the road we could have made it down without touching the air brakes. As Bob Harnden would know, There's no replacement for displacement. As is generally known, every generality is false, including this one.
Each situation must be assessed on it's merits.

Ron Baran 09 Magna 7025 ISX Allison 4000

Re: Trailer and Exhaust Brakes

Reply #24 –
Yahoo Message Number: 67861
Ron,

That is the hill I spend much time on, up and down. I can make the trip down much as you describe IF the hill is empty enough of traffic. What gets me is the unexpected-have to stops- from others on the hill. That is when I used to experience getting brakes hot. Or if an 18 wheeler was trying to run me over and pushed me down.

For example, our previous MH was a gas. Could come down the hill on compression and touch the brakes seldom. Then all at once would have to use brakes more and would have hot brakes at the bottom. Found the cause was the electric wires on just one brake was bad. One trailer brake not woking made the difference between hot brakes or not at the bottom.

I think Cat uses a real Jake type brake as compared to an exhaust brake. Also one can have to much exhaust brake and cause engine damage from to much back pressure. Cummins, I think, had a recall on exhaust brakes to enlarge the holes in the damper to lessen the back pressure, or maybe it was Ford.

Not sure there are to many hills as hard as the Willamette Pass. Seems most of the others we hit are not. Good test of equipment going up and down.

Leonard

97' Magna 5418