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Radiator Replacement - So California

Yahoo Message Number: 75648
Our 2002 Intrigue has sprung a coolant leak that appears to coming from the lower rear of the radiator. Fortunately we're safe in a campground. I've been informed that it is an aluminum radiator and lucky to have made it this far. I've located a source for a replacement copper/steel radiator (through Kevin Waite) but I face other logistical issues and hopefully this knowledgeable group can offer some suggestions/comments.
I contacted Coach-Net and they want to disconnect the drive shaft and lift the front end of the coach to tow it. It has an IFS front end. That worries me and I would have preferred a flat-bed tow. Do I have any real concerns?
I'm located in Seal Beach, CA (near Long Beach) and have a history with good work by Colton Truck but that is well outside the 20 or so mile tow range offered. Of course I could pay for the extra mileage to get to Colton Truck but I hate to think of being dragged that far. Coach-Net suggested LA Freightliner in Carson, CA. Anyone have any experience with them? They are a Cummins Service center but this is not a Freightliner chassis. So I'm looking for suggestions for major service facilities relative to our location in Seal Beach.
I'm assuming that I can start the engine with low coolant level for long enough to back it out of our current campground space so that it can be hooked up for a tow. Or can I ????
I'm open to all comments, suggestions, recommendations, or concerns on-line or off-line.

Thanks, Steve B (#11382)
520-907-6379

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75649
How serious is the leak? If it isn't pouring out, you could fill the cooling system and make it to Colton. If it is a serious leak, you could stop for a refill along the way.
If you can see where the leak is, you could stuff the leak with JB Weld.
If you don't have the hydronic heater, you could use some Stop Leak and try to slow the leak.
You can start the coach with low coolant but the motor will shut down after a short run. With a fill up, it should run long enough to back out of your site. You have about 61 miles to drive.
Disconnecting the drive shaft isn't an issue if it is the only way to get it to a repair facility. Lifting the front end won't hurt anything.
I would opt for Colton as they are experienced with CC. I am not a fan of Freightliner.

Don

'02 Intrigue #11427
'02 Intrigue #11427

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75652
Put water in and drive. Keep checking and put in more water if needed.

John drebick 06 Affinity 6550

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75662
The big issue is cross contamination between the engine coolant section and the transmission cooler section. If that happens be prepared to spend some bucks. I had no indication of leaks externally or overheating of the engine and the transmission was shifting perfectly, but then the warning light came on and the tranny was a quart low. I turned off the engine added fluid restarted and and the control module for the tranny reset and all seemed well, later down the road all hell broke loose and the engine was derated as was the tranny. $8000.00 later.
TWI 2004 Intrigue 11731

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75665
Steve, We had a similar event in Rifle, Co. in '08. The leak was fast enough that we placed a bucket under the cooling system until I added 2 bottles of Barrs Leak in the reservoir and refilled with water. As soon as the water level was above the lo-level sensor the engine restarted and ran normal. The leak partially sealed and was drivable back to Florida (4 week drive) where I dropped the assembly and took the radiator to the shop. Our copper/steel assembly had a stone nick in one tube, but an ongoing problem was the gaskets between the tanks and the core. Often I topped off the cooling system because of a nusense loss that had been a gallon every summer. Also, check hose clamps that may have relaxed from temp changes. Hope this helps.....Skip, 2002 Intrigue #11329

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75685
Steve keep us posted. We have an older Allure with the other Radiator. I agree with the other posters on driving a short distance and topping off as needed. I did not know Coach Net had a 20 mile rule. Ken 99 Allure 30356

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75699
Tom Insall wrote: The big issue is cross contamination between the engine coolant section and the transmission cooler section.
I don't understand the cross contamination. Yes the transmission cooler is mounted on the outside of the engine radiator but the engine coolant that is leaking is green (Fleetgard ES Compleat coolant) and I assume that the transmission cooler is filled with transmission fluid which is not bright green. Right???? Am I missing something?
Today I will be pouring 5 gallons of coolant that I have collected so far back into the engine cooling system and firing up the engine to see how badly it leaks with the engine running. I will of course leave the radiator cap loose so as not to build up pressure. If coolant continues to just drip and not come gushing out then I will risk driving to the repair facility rather than having it towed. The Coach-Net tow agent wants to disconnect the driveshaft to tow it on the road. I'm trying to avoid that.

Steve B, 2002 Intrigue, #11382
520-907-6379

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75700
Arthur Pohle wrote: Steve, We had a similar event in Rifle, Co. in '08. The leak was fast enough that we placed a bucket under the cooling system until I added 2 bottles of Barrs Leak in the reservoir and refilled with water. As soon as the water level was above the lo-level sensor the engine restarted and ran normal. The leak partially sealed and was drivable back to Florida (4 week drive) where I dropped the assembly and took the radiator to the shop.
Thanks for the input but I've been cautioned about putting anything like that into the cooling system since it also circulates through the Hydronic heater system and I don't want to foul up any inline pumps. Yes, there are some bypasses that could be accomplished but crawling under the coach to attempt that is not really feasible. So I will avoid introducing sealers into the system.

Steve B, #11382, 2002 Intrigue

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75702
The engine coolant radiator and transmission cooler our bifurcated, two working as one. Different tanks, but the tubes are sharing the same assembly. So if there is a coolant leak to the atmosphere all is well, but if there is a breakdown and coolant of the engine is allowed to mix with transmission oil failure of something is for sure. Usually the pumps and bands in the transmission, seals, etc etc. Transmissions don't like engine coolant. On my Intrigue the top radiator street side in the Charge air cooler for the turbo, below it is the radiator for the hydraulic system, Mounted on exterior of these two is a much smaller dash air radiator. Then mounted behind these are the engine transmission radiator assembly, with fan shroud, fan, and fan controller. Ever wonder why the transmission temp tracks the engine temp so closely, they share adjacent cores. I imagine there is an oil cooler mixed up in there too. When the temps get close to 210 degrees my oil pressure drops five to 10 lbs. That will get your attention. So get 'em fixed at a time and place of your choice. TWI 2004 intrigue 11731

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75706
Steve

Coach Net towed us from Pueblo Co to North of Denver.

A lot more than 20 miles.

Dan 2006 Allure 31348

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75709
Use 2 ounces of black pepper. It will slow the leak and not cause a problem.

Mikee

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75713
When I had to be towed transmission repair. I was towed by flat bed. Coach Net said they would tow to the nearest qualified repair facility. Any farther than that I would have to pay additional money for tow.

Bo Lee

2000 Magna #5896



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From: Dan Fahrion

To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2011 2:27 PM Subject: RE: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Steve

Coach Net towed us from Pueblo Co to North of Denver.

A lot more than 20 miles.

Dan 2006 Allure 31348

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Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75715
Steve,

I hope you work out the logistics. My experience with my failed rad: would not hold enough water/coolant to run more than a few minutes... a real gusher! I was towed with a drive shaft disconnected with no problem at all. Thank goodness for a very knowledgeable driver!
IMPORTANT: Be sure that if towed, an air line to your coach from the tow truck is attached. This provides air to the air suspension!!!!!
Dick May

2002 Intrigue, #11438
Dick May
2002 Intrigue, #11438, towing a
2014 Jeep Gr Cherokee ecoDiesel

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75722
Mikee, I know that your advice is usually irrefutable but I must ask in all seriousness whether you are kidding when you suggest using 2 ounces of black pepper to slow the radiator leak and not cause a problem. If one were to try such a nonconventional method would you advise course or fine grind? J
Fortunately I don't think that I will have to resort to "spicing up" my cooling system. Yesterday I put all 5 gallons of the retrieved dripping coolant plus a little extra back into the cooling system, put the radiator cap on loosely, fired up the engine, and ran it for about 20 minutes. In that time the coolant temperature slowly crept up to 110-degrees and was still slowly rising when I shut it down. So that all appeared to be normal. The leak continued as just a drip-drip-drip with no gushing so we are preparing to make the 60-mile drive to Colton Truck for the radiator replacement in about 2 weeks. I'll monitor the temperature and be prepared to add "unseasoned" liquid to the system.

Steve B, 2002 Intrigue #11382

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75738
Sorry, I was serious. It works well. Either fine or coarse works well.

Mikee

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 75739
he is right pepper works, this is an old truckers trick . i've used it on my Mack truck back in the '60s went 250 mi.. that's when I learned you don't have olddradiators repaired, unless they have bolt on tanks, you replace them.... bob '02 Magna 6028

From: "Mbaul@..."

To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, November 21, 2011 8:26 AM Subject: Re: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Sorry, I was serious. It works well. Either fine or coarse works well.

Mikee

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 76290
Back in November I wrote about a leaking radiator on my 2002 Country Coach Intrigue (Cummins 370 ISL). Initially over 5 gallons of coolant leaked out of the radiator while parked. I collected all this coolant in buckets, refilled the cooling system, left the radiator cap loose so as not to build up pressure, and ran the engine for about 20 minutes to see if coolant was going to squirt out or just continue dripping. It just dripped which gave me confidence that I could drive the coach 60 miles to Colton Truck, my repair facility of choice, rather than having it towed.
I originally thought that it was an aluminum core radiator and that that was what had led to the failure but it turned out to be a copper and steel radiator and the cause of the leak was rocks that had been thrown up and hit the side of the radiator. It could have been re-cored but I opted for a new radiator that Colton just happened to have on hand and it was the right model.
Colton Truck Terminal did a great job on the radiator replacement and all the additional service and repair items that needed to be done. They caught another problem that could have been catastrophic. A year earlier they had recommended that I change a leaking oil pan gasket so I told them to do that while it was in the shop. When they dropped the pan they found large amounts of aluminum shavings in the pan and so they cut open the oil filter and it was also filled with aluminum shavings. Long story short ? after removing the front (actually rear) engine cover they found that a bearing in the air compressor (which is driven by steel gears at the rear of the engine) had gone bad and the compressor was ready to come apart and was grinding against the housing. So that led to the need for a new air compressor and a new oil cooler (there was no way to be assured that the fine tubes in the oil cooler weren't also filled with aluminum shavings).
During a final test drive they also discovered that the engine fan was running at full speed all the time. This problem was traced to a wire that had been burned because it was too close to the exhaust manifold. That was a relatively simple fix and now the fan cycles with temperature as it is supposed to do. Hopefully that may also result in better fuel mileage.
So after many $$$$ we're back in business again and as in previous years I continue to be very impressed with the quality of the service and repair by Colton Truck Terminal (in Colton California). Their creature comforts such as waiting rooms, coffee and donuts, and the like are non-existent but their mechanical and technical service are top notch. This time we had to leave the coach for many days but usually when we just go in for service we park beside their facility overnight and they will bring the coach out of the shop for us to sleep in if it requires an extra overnight. They'll run out a 15-amp cord if you need it. We've done that on a few occasions and just set our inverter to 15 amps so we don't pop their breaker.

Just thought you's like to know!

Steve B, coach #11382

Re: Radiator Replacement - So California

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 76291
Steve thanks for sharing. There is a thread on this form about Cummins problems with Air Comperssors failing. Sorry to hear about the Failures. As a Retired Cat Service tech I have seen it all. At our Boomerangs when Im there I give diesel roundtables and try to go to someones rig and do an Inspect on the Engine. I have the smaller C-8.3 and only 75k miles on the coach. Ken fellow SKP Boomer in Yuma. 99 Allure 30356.