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Tire air pressure help needed

Yahoo Message Number: 96873
Hi Everyone,

I now have (8) new tires on the Intrigue (Toyo - installed by previous owner as part of the purchase price). In looking at the information on the tires I find the adjusted pressures to be 90 psi (front), 105 psi (drive) and 90 psi on the tag. Scale weights show 12,632 (front), 24,569 (drive) and 3,7201 (tag). I am not sure if I have done this correctly so I thought I would ask around for examples of where you folks pressurize to.

2004 Country Coach Intrigue - #11772 Ovation series - (3) slides

42'-0" long @ 45,000 gvwr with Tag axle pulling a 2013 x 5,000# x 4 door jeep wrangler Unlimited

Glen and Barb Burgess

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96874
Get ready for diverse opinions. Regardless, you need to get the manufacture's tire pressure/weight table for your tires. Divide your front weight by 2 and use that number; divide drive by 4, use that. Consult the table. Find the closest right weight. Add 10 PSI for safety and put those pressures in the 2 front and 4 drive tires.

Try to do this around 70 degrees air temperature, preferable in the morning before the sun starts heating up some of the tires and the rig has not been driven for some hours. Don't do it after driving the coach. For each 10 degrees above 70, subtract 2 psi for each 10 degrees above 70 as your target pressure. Colder, subtract 2 psi for each 10 degrees.

The tags are carrying less weight. If it were me I'd run them 10 psi lower than the drive tires.

The toad is irrelevant to the tire pressure determination.

Hope this helps.
Lee (leozbrowski@...) President, CCI

2007 Country Coach Intrigue 12153
CAT C-13

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96875
Lee,

I know this may be one of those "diverse"? opinions, but shouldn't you base the tire pressure on the tire with the greatest load? In other words, if the left front is carrying a greater load than the right front, the pressure should be based on the load of the left. Otherwise, you may stand a good chance of under-inflating the side with the greatest load.

Fred Compton
2005 Magna #6454

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96877
You are correct Jeff but most can't get individual wheel weights and have to use axle weight.
One other is duals have different inflation table. You still divide by 2 but use dual table for inflation pressure. Duals do NOT have double the carrying capacity of a single tire at any given pressure.

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96882
Glen and Barb,

My CC is similar to yours in weight. On ours to the left of the drivers seat on the wall is a label with the factories recommendation for tire pressure. That is a good place to start for tire inflation pressures.

In reading your current pressures you are doing opposite from the factory recommendations and what I have done for the last five years. Usually the front (steer) tires have the most pressure. Read duals (drive) tires the least. And the tap tires a bit more than the drive tires. That is the way it is on my CC label and the way I have inflated the last five years.

IMHO 90 is likely too low for your steer tires. I normally use about 120 for the steer tires. 100-110 for the drive. And 115-120 for the tag.

Many people advise weighing your coach for each wheel and adjusting to the tire makers recommendations. This is the best, although most time consuming, method. About three summers ago when at the CC factory they put the label recommended pressures in my coach. It drove better.

Welcome to your new to you coach.

Bob and Barbara
2002 42' Affinity.

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96887
I'm curious as to why the tags should have pressure equal to, or near, the front tires. The tags generally carry less load than any of the other tires. Also, it is my belief, rightly or wrongly, that the placard you refer to is much too general since the factory has no knowledge of how much load various coaches may carry. One size fits all is not a good way to establish the optimum tire pressure. The lawyers like it though. (sorry Bill S.) Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96888
The placard is for original tires and coach loaded to gvwr. SSO ifyou have newer tires it may be different. This includes if you replaced with same tire as technology changes constantly and the recommended pressure may change.
Second is if you are running below gvwr then then best case you are getting a rougher ride then you should. Worse case you are riding on the center rib and minimizing contact patch agreavating any handling issue.

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96891
I'm with Lyle. If the tag tires carry less load then there is no reason the pressure should be higher than the duals.

The only reasonable rational I've heard for significant pressure in the tags, other than helping carrying load over 20,000 lbs on the dual axle, is if a dual tire fails. I run my tag tires at 85, 10 psi below the duals but 10 above the manufacturers 75 psi minimum.
Lee (leozbrowski@...) President, CCI

2007 Country Coach Intrigue 12153
CAT C-13

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96892
If you'll look at Magnas and Affinities that used 295's and 12 R's on the rears and duals you'll see terrific edge wear on Good year tag and front tires and the only way to slow that down is to increase the

pressure. Later coaches with Michelin 315's didn't have the issue so much.
Even coaches with Michelin

12R's didn't have the issue. I know I didn't. I now have Continental 315's on the coach that have tread

wear indicators on the edges. And to keep my tag wear down to a slow roar I have to run 117+ lbs.

The same goes for the fronts. Only the duals can I run at or around 110 lbs. TWI 2004 42" Intrigue

117311. I way 39,900 going down the road full of fuel and water, plus stuff.

Original email:
-----------------

From: Lee Zaborowski leozbrowski@... [Country-Coach-Owners] Country-Coach-

Owners@yahoogroups.com Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2014 17:58:34 -0500 To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Tire air pressure help needed

I'm with Lyle. If the tag tires carry less load then there is no reason the pressure should be higher than the duals.
The only reasonable rational I've heard for significant pressure in the tags, other than helping carrying load over 20,000 lbs on the dual axle, is if a dual tire fails. I run my tag tires at 85, 10 psi below the duals but 10 above the manufacturers 75 psi minimum.

Lee (leozbrowski@...) President, CCI

2007 Country Coach Intrigue 12153
CAT C-13

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96893
IMHO " . . . the only way to slow that down is to . . . " get rid of the Goodyears, period. I had Goodyears with that problem. I am very opinionated on this, have lost count of all the Goodyears I've seen with the edge wear.


My Intrigue, at 43,000 lbs, now with Michlein 315s on the front (115 psi), Bridgestone 295s on the back (95 psi duals, 85 psi tag) are happy, happy after 4 and 3 years, well over 30,000 miles and going strong. I'm sure I'll make it to 7 years.

The Goodyears didn't make it 2 years and 27,000 miles.
Lee (leozbrowski@...) President, CCI

2007 Country Coach Intrigue 12153
CAT C-13

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96896
The placard in the CC Intrigue (42' tag) shows (295/80R22.5 tire) 120# on steer, 110# on drive and 120# on tag. The CC weight results (12/17/2003) show: frt driver @ 6315, Frt Pass @ 6318 Drive axle - driver @ 11929 (5964/tire) pass axle @ 12,639 (6319) tag per side - not shown
Vehicle weight @ 37,201

I have not loaded it so am assuming the weights are still relatively close.
FYI these were Samson tires not Toyo - fingers just moved without mind engaged.

Now the only place I have to weigh is a Cat scale with a 3 segment scale. There are guard posts so I cannot do individual weights. I will do this in a week or so when I have a minute. All that said I think until I understand this better I will inflate to placard levels even though the reduced inflation's shown on the Toyo sheet seem more appropriate.

Samson Single show 7390 @ 120#
Samson Dual show 6780 @ 120#

Toyo Single show 6545 @ 100#
Toyo Dual show 6490 @ 115#

Goodyear Single show 7390 @ 115#
Goodyear Dual show 6610 @ 115#

Now we have not loaded the coach but I know from the last 15 years of carrying stuff around that we will add about 1,500 lbs. Assuming DW does not redecorate just because she can in this unit.

Thanks

Glen and Barb Burgess
2004 CC Intrigue 42' tag
2013 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96898
Lee,

I am no tire expert. I put air in the tires mostly based on what the current Country Coach factory recommended. I rarely use the full amount recommended on the label as we usually do not load our coach with much weight. And I do adjust pressure to try and keep the wear pattern edge and center the same.

I did ask about why the tag had more pressure when I was at CC about three years ago. But as with a lot of things these days my memory is not so good.

In 42 years of motor homing I have only had one small tire problem. That was a nail in the side wall when I had my old GMC motorhome. I believe I did wear out the edges on some Michelins I had for steers a couple of years ago. Edges were worn and centers OK. So guess that was too low pressure.

Bob & Barbara
2002 Affinity 42'

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96899
Lee,

I currently have two Goodyears on the tag. Six years old and no problems. I have used also Michelin, Dunlop (owned by Goodyear), BF Goodrich, and Firestone in the last ten years on motorhomes. All had no problems. I used to think Michelin was the cat's meow on tires. I do not any more. The last two sets I have bought for my cars have both had issues. One set would not balance no matter what. So Discount tire gave me a new set that ran fine. We currently have a set of Michelins on our MDX Acura, very hard to balance. Never have been right. When I bought my coach it had Michelins on everything but the tags. Since I have had good luck with several different makers of tires I shop price. The only thing I am adamant about is that the tires are made in the USA. The set of steers that wore out prematurely were Michelin made in Spain. They also oxidized before their time. I think the best tires are made here.

I also have a set of Goodyears on my jeep that came with it. They have been great. Made in the USA.

Bob & Barbara
42' Affinity 2002

2013 Jeep Wrangler tow car and play toy.

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96900
The one greatest hazard to any tire is over-heating. This can be caused by overloading and most commonly under-inflation. Inflating the tires closer to max pressure decreases road resistance which lowers temp and increases mileage and tire life. Duals have to be inflated to a lower max pressure than singles. This may be due to the crown on roads. Having two tires next each would require slightly more flex so that one tire would not try to carry the load of the two. That is why it is also critically important that two adjacent tires have equal pressure. Otherwise the tire with higher pressure will be carrying a higher load and thus overheat and possibly fail.

The tag being singles can have a higher pressure because they are singles. Having a higher pressure also reduces the need to add air should you decide to carry a larger load than usual.

Another reason to use a higher pressure than you may think you need, strong side winds. The lea ward side of coach is now carrying a higher than normal load as the wind pushes the coach. Here in the Midwest, 30+ mile an hour winds pop up every time a start my coach and hit the road (so if I am traveling, you may want park).

The new TPMS that I put in my coach when I put new tires on keeps track of the temp too. A nice feature that can allow to spot possible tire problems that just pressure may not.

On the 2200 mile shakedown trip last week, it was quite calming knowing it was there.
My tire temps all stayed within a few degrees of each other which tells me my tire pressures are good for my coach. I started with 115 on the steers and 110 on the drives for my baseline at 70 degrees.

Greg, '99 Magna

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96902
The main reason dials have lower ratings is cooling air is reduced by the second tire in close proximity. It is also the reason for minimum dual spacing spec from manufacture's, not just to keep them from touching.

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96904
In the trucking industry the standard is 110 in the steers and 10-0 in all others. Anything less than 100 tends to overheat the tire. This being said you may need more base on load, but should never be less.

Mikee

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96907
My placard calls for the tags to have 95lbs and the steer to have 120lbs which is a material difference.

Dan 2006 Allure 31348

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96990
My belief is most of us travel through sharp turns to fast or fail to wait before the tag raises as we go

through sharp turns which can peel the edges off the tags, especially with lower inflation pressures.

Another reason maybe to protect the side walls from deforming on sharp turns. I have driven on 4 or

5 roads where I have really abused the tag tires. Hwy 29 coming into Calistoga from the east, Driving

between Stanton Virginia And Cass West Virginia the short way. Diving from Lincoln to Junction City

Oregon, and from Durango to Ouray or Vise versa. All can really chew up the tag if you are in second

gear on those sharp curves, especially near Red Mountain. I've learned to slow down and raise the tag

when I can, but most of the time the natives and the 18 wheelers won't let me. TWI 2004 42" Intrigue
11731

Original email:
-----------------

From: lylewet@... [Country-Coach-Owners] Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Date: 10 Aug 2014 13:50:01 -0700

To: Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Country-Coach-Owners] Re: Tire air pressure help needed

I'm curious as to why the tags should have pressure equal to, or near, the front tires. The tags generally

carry less load than any of the other tires. Also, it is my belief, rightly or wrongly, that the placard you refer to is much too general since the factory has no knowledge of how much load various coaches may

carry. One size fits all is not a good way to establish the optimum tire pressure. The lawyers like it
though. (sorry Bill S.)
Lyle Wetherholt
04 Intrigue 11740

mail2web LIVE Free email based on Microsoft Exchange technology - http://link.mail2web.com/LIVE

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 96991
The tag axle is an integral factor in the stability and handling of the coach. Traveling 550 from Silverton to Ouray is not a place where I would want it compromised in any way. Fortunately the tag is programmed so that for it to raise, the transmission must be in first gear and the speed of the coach must be below 14 MPH. The light on the dash only indicates that you are calling for the tag to raise when and if the programmed conditions are met. It is likely the 14 mph that is upsetting the locals and truckers.
Don Seager
Ex CC Owner

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 97024
I have been reading all of the discussions. I have raised my tire pressures to that shown on the sticker in the coach (120 steer, 100 drive, 120 tag) and now have a rougher ride. The overall handling does not seem to be affected however. There does not appear to be any tire information from Samson other than the maximum load rating for the tires I have. Therefore, trying to adjust the pressure down would be a guessing game by me. That said I would do so if I had a tire pressure monitoring system that provided tire temperatures. I have been considering the TST system. Would this be a smart, safe, or really stupid approach to lowering the pressures. Of course I can just let the issue drop since the coach already rides and handles so much better than the 2007 gasser I sold to get the CC! Thanks

Glen Burgess

2004 Intrigue 42' tag

2013 Jeep Wrangler unlimited

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #23 –
Yahoo Message Number: 97026
Glen

I bought my coach used, all of the recalls had been done by previous owner ( tires had been replaced and ride height valves had been moved). It still had Toyo tires! I read all the info and raised my tire pressure to comply on tire placard from CC. I Called CC and was told that I still did not have the updated placard, when they sent me the new one I raised the tire pressure to comply. I had the coach weighed on 4 corners. A few month later I blew the RF tire while driving on I75. I talked with National Safety Board investigator and was told the damage to my tires had already been done by driving with low pressure. The coach weight was past the limit for the tires. I replaced the tires with tires that carried more weight. He told me use the tire guide lines plus 5/10 psi and I would have no problems. He said that having higher weight rating on the tire would allow me to do this as the limits set by CC were based on the lower rated Toyos.

I recommend that you get a 4 corner weight done on you coach. Read the tire weight rating for your tires and if your weights are below the rating placard from CC adjust the pressure for a better ride. Hope this helps.

Vick Welsh

99 Intrigue 10714

Re: Tire air pressure help needed

Reply #24 –
Yahoo Message Number: 97028
Thanks, I am in small town Iowa and there is no place that will do the four corners for me. Therefore I am using the tire mfgr ratings for weight. I guess I will quit worrying and just get on with business. I need to do a few other things before we head to Seattle in a couple of weeks. We are taking I80 to Salt Lake City and then up to Portland OR and then on to Seattle. We will keep our fingers crossed and hope for the best since this will be the first time this (new to us) coach has really moved in nearly 4 years.

Glen Burgess

2004 Intrigue #11772