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Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Yahoo Message Number: 112361
Setting up in new location tonight I happened to check the house batteries (two AGMs) and notice the are hot to the touch and possibly beginning to bulge. The Trace RC7 control indicates batteries at 100% charge, yet the charge is in full absorption mode. Does anyone know how I might disable the Echo Charge unit in order to remain plugged in to shore power without frying the batteries?

John Coleman
'02 Intrigue 11467

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112362
Adding to my question, I'm in Bend, Oregon and wondering if someone can recommend a repair shop here that could repair this for me?

John Coleman

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112363
The old Beaver Motor Coach repairs in bend

Robert McClernon
2000 Intrigue
40 one slide cummins 375

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112366
John
You should be able to turn off the inverter at the remote panel inside the coach. Pretty sure this will also turn off the battery charger.
Vince.
Intrigue
#11332

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112369
You can shut down the Echo Charger by removing its two inline fuses.

pete
2000 40' Magna CAT C-10, #5892
Pete
 2000 40'  Magna #5892  CAT C-10

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112423
Hopefully you have gotten it taken care of, late on my response...

The echo charger is really for the Chassis battery while connected to AC, and for the Coach battery while driving.....

The Inverter / Charger is most likely the issue, try turning it off for a 6-8 hrs.....

Kevin

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112434
Kevin,

The Echo Charger is not a player in battery charging when driving. The house and chassis batteries are connected in parallel via a relay which is triggered by an engine oil pressure switch.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112435
Thanks, George - so if the chassis battery charges while driving (from the alternator) and the house batteries do not; where should one look to remedy that.
Ken
p.s. The on-board charger does charge the house batteries.​

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112437
Hey George,

If they are connected in parallel when driving, then they are both charging by the alternator, correct?

Mark in Buena Vista
07 Inspire 51985

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112439
Ken,

The Battery Boost solenoid should close when the engine is running connecting the house batteries to the chassis battery (and alternator). There is a sensor on the engine that senses oil pressure and closes to ground. This should close the battery boost solenoid any time there is oil pressure in the engine. Mine is located right next to the regular oil pressure sensor on the side of the engine block. My battery boost solenoid is located in with the chassis battery but yours could be different.

Barney
07 Inspire 52059

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112441
Thanks, Barney - I think I understand the circuitry SOMEWHAT, it's just that there must be a 'gap' in the (parallel?) line fr​om my alternator to the house batteries since they do not charge while driving.
Ken
2006 Inspire 360
p.s. hmmm ... perhaps the chassis battery isn't being charged either - it just holds it's charge from stop to stop where we plug into shore power....
I will check that on our trip next month.

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112443
If your house batteries do not charge while driving you are looking for the Boost solenoid. Don't know where yours is. Mine is in the bay behind the batteries along with the inverter. Someone with an Intrigue will chime in.

You can test the solenoid by having someone hold the boost solenoid switch while you check the voltage at both batteries. They should be the same or at least very close to the same voltage.

The boost switch and an oil pressure switch activates the solenoid. The oil pressure switch activates the solenoid when oil pressure builds up when the engine is running. It doesn't take much pressure to activate the switch. If the test with the boost switch indicates the solenoid is working then you probably have a faulty oil pressure switch. This could be as simple as a wire not connected to the switch.

If the solenoid is good then you can charge the house batteries when the engine is running by holding the boost switch on. Maybe come up with a way to keep it in the on position without having to hold it.

When my boost solenoid failed I jumpered across the positive terminals on the house and chassis batteries when I ran the engine. This is what the boost solenoid does. I added a switch between the two batteries so I didn't have to unhook and hook up jumpers. I lived like this for about a month until I could get a new solenoid installed.

pete
2000 40' Magna CAT C-10, #5892
Pete
 2000 40'  Magna #5892  CAT C-10

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112445
Ok I have a 2007 Intrigue and mine has a device called a Smart battery combiner made by Magnum. It senses the charge of the chassis batteries then charges the house batteries. Now I haven't confirmed this but I believe that is how it works
Darrell
2007 Intrigue 12075
Cat C13

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112446
Ken, If your house battery does not charge from alternator You should look at the combiner/boost relay which is a fair sized solenoid located near your Echo Charger. Also, take a look at the oil pressure sensor which is the trigger to close the relay and parallel the chassis and house banks. With the engine running you want to check the voltage at both the chassis and house banks to see if they are both being charged. If it is as you say, and the house is not charging, I would use something to hold the boost switch closed and see if that solves your problem.

If your installed charger/converter doesn't charge the house I suspect that it is dead and would start my troubleshooting with that in mind. Charging the house bank is the only mission of the on board charger.

Good luck.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112447
Mark, that is correct.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112448
Darrell, what you describe is the opposite of the charge system design. The purpose of the Echo Charge/Magnum combiner is to take charge from the house bank and supply it to the chassis bank. The EC is one way and will pass up to 15 amps from house to chassis. The Magnum is bi directional and will supply up to 25 amps from either to the other. But, 25 amps will never get the job done for your house and the chassis to house direction is purely incidental. That is why the inverter/charger is connected only to the house bank. And why the alternator is connected to both. And why the EC was installed to maintain the chassis with minimal charge.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112449
Since you stated the onboard charger doesn't charge you may have a common issue, like bad batter(ies), or a loose ground. When the batteries are charged do all your 12 volt controls work?

Ray

They say wine improves with age! As I enter my golden years, I say age improves with wine! The Born Loser

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112450
Darrell, if you have a problem, you've not explained what it is??

Lee Z
07 Intrigue

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112452
"Maybe come up with a way to keep it in the on position without having to hold it."

I've found that a wooden clothespin under the rear portion of the boost switch works well.

John
2006 Inspire 51919

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112455
Thanks George. I wasn't clear on that. It makes perfect sense

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112477
I agree while driving

I was responding to your email about the echo charger....

sandersgeorgel@... [Country-Coach-Owners]

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Country-Coach-Owners@yahoogroups.com

Sep 20 at 4:14 PM

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Kevin,

The Echo Charger is not a player in battery charging when driving. The house and chassis batteries are connected in parallel via a relay which is triggered by an engine oil pressure switch.

George in Birmingham
'03 Magna 6298

Posted by: sandersgeorgel@...

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Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112480
The oil pressure switch to combine the battery Banks is interesting, but my 07 Allure never had that functionality. It would be interesting to know where that relay is, if there is such a relay. It would have to be absolutely huge to handle the amperage to combine the Banks. After buying my 07 Allure new, I installed a battery switch and leave the house and Battery Banks combined except when dry camping. Don't rely on my echo charger, I installed a 100 amp smart charger for my backup in line.

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112483
Brian,

I would be surprised if you didn't have the battery boost relay. Do you have a switch somewhere on the dash that's labeled 'BATT BOOST'? If so you have it. The link below has a picture of the relay. It's the small round white thing on the right with the large red cables attached.

http://moenracing.com/images/Batt_Boost.jpg

Barney
07 Inspire

Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #23 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112490
Yes I have the battery boost switch and relay but what we're talking about is a combiner basically from the house battery to the engine battery. The battery boost relay is for momentary use to combine the battery Banks and not for continual use. It will burn up. That's why I put a high amperage 300 amp switch in to combine the battery Banks except for when I'm dry camping when I can turn it off and separate the House and engine batteries. I have all AGM batteries both house and engine batteries and they all wear out at the same time along with having more than enough power.I have been using the system for 8 years now and it's great. I also installed a large 300 amp bypass switch above my master panel inside for my sub panel so when I'm in an RV park with 50 amps, I can switch over the inverter circuit to a full 50 amps which allows the inverter to idle free and not overload the bypass relays in the inverter. this helps provide enough power to the sub-panel circuits and all my plugins without blowing circuit breakers when I'm under heavy loads.

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

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Re: Looking for help on an issue with house batteries

Reply #24 –
Yahoo Message Number: 112498
The Battery Boost switch is momentary because it is often used to allow the house battery to supply a portion of the cold cranking amps being drawn by the started motor. A weakened chassis battery cannot supply enough amps to sufficiently crank the engine. The amount of amps added by the house batteries is dependant on the condition of the chassis battery and could by very high. Hence a non - latching boost switch.

However once the engine is started and the alternator is supplying power the picture has changed. In fact once the engine oil pressure is seen by a sensor it closes the boost relay and leaves the chassis and house batteries in parallel as long as the engine is running. It is how your house batteries are charged when you are on the road.

Chassis batteries and house batteries are different in design. Chassis batteries are usually rated in cold cranking amps while deep cell house batteries are rated in amp_hrs. Connecting batteries in parallel that have different characteristics as the sole source of power should always be done with care.

Don Seager
Former CC Owner