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Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Hi folks,

I've never owned an RV before, and we're looking at a 2008 Affinity.  I'm old enough that I don't want to waste my time trading up later from anything less that that, LOL.  Our sales guy has been rather decent and has given us lots of information, but I don't know enough to know what questions to ask.  I do know this coach needs tires and batteries, and they say we should change the inverters too.  Anything else we should look for or ask about?

Thanks,
Doug
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #1 –
Hi Doug;
  There are some issues with these coaches. Some minor but some can be major. Firstly I would run the 4 digit coach number through Damon Rapozo's website and also reach out to him regarding any particular CC you are looking at. He has a wealth of knowledge, including original ordering sheets and some service records as does Premier RV Services in Junction City OR.

There are some things to watch out for with the later model Cummins ISX engines , in particular the 650hp versions, so service records will be very important there. Other things to consider when making an offer. Tires are about 2k per pair (plus installation) and the recommended Lifeline batteries are about $750 a piece, and you could go crazy $$$$ switching to Lithium. Overall CC was way ahead of their time and these coaches are still darlings of the industry.

Happy Trails;
Ch

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #2 –
Thanks, I'll get the coach number and check out Damon's site.

I'm pretty sure this is the 600HP version.  I've been told it only has a particulate filter on it, no DEF whatever that means.  (Just haven't taken the time to look it up yet...)

They just put new AGM batteries in it, so apparently it starts up now.  We'll have to see about the other six batteries.

I'll definitely ask about service records.

I think this thing is absolutely beautiful.  Love the paint colors, love the interior layout.  We've looked at a couple other newer used coaches, but nothing really compares.  I do wish it had a real mattress in the sofa, but I guess we can add that later...

Thanks again!
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #3 –
A quick with to confirm if it's a Pre DPF ISX600 (Also nicknamed 'Dirty' and as FYI, it should have the CM870 configuration engine build. DPF era 'Clean' ISX600's, will be a CM871 build.) - is to look at the back passenger side basement bays. If you have two behind the Tag, it's Pre DPF. If you have one large basement bay, it's CM871. IF it's a CM871, I personally would negotiate a price to allow the pro-active upgraded Head Replacement at a Cummins Shop. This could go from the $15-20K range, depending upon local shop hour rates, and also items being replaced at the same time as the head swap out. (Which is not a bad idea, as the labor of tearing down and getting the head off, makes replacing any recommended or questionable other components a great time to do so:)!) The new heads are so far handling the dripping slide/crud into the number 6 (And sometimes number 5.) valves, causing erosion and eventually failure.. Costly when this happens. And IMO, a quality good condition Magna or Affinity, is well worth investing the funds into to set it up for the long haul. Heck, say it's a $225K purchase, and you end up doing some new owner modifications and engine head swap and put $40K into it. NOTHING on the market new, for $265K, will be near the quality of these coaches. ---- The Affinity has flush mounted windows, which along with custom paint scheme, sets it apart from the Magna. The flush mounted windows are cool, but can be problematic and more expensive to maintain over the years ahead. Look carefully around all windows, below all windows, for any signs of leaking and possible de-lamination. And for signs of fogging. Fogging can be repaired, but more expensive for the flush mounted windows. And when you buy that coach, or any CC coach for that matter. Being your first one, you will have a steep learning curve. So plan to stay at the place your purchasing it, or near it, for a few days. Go thru the systems, read the manuals, ask questions here and on Face Book CC pages (Worth joining.) - and keep asking the place that you bought it follow-up questions as they come up. And I do recommend RV Driving School for new large coach owner's, it's a small amount, insurance discount too, and it will greatly accelerate your comfort level while driving, and navigating in RV Parks:)! Best of luck to you. - Smitty
04 Allure Sold to a nice new owner! Now enjoying a 07 Magna Rembrandt 45' ISX600 #6775
"We're ONDROAD for THEJRNY!" (Toad and Coach license plates, say Hi if you see us!)

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #4 –
What @Smitty said too. Sage advice from an old CC pro whos been around the block a few times. Also, you should get a picture of the build sheet. It'll be behind a vanity door in the bathroom or water closet. It will tell you all kinds of stuff from the engine to what stuff was put in the coach when it was built (genset, Silverleaf, inverter type etc) so you will have a good idea of how it came out from the factory. Of course over time some of that stuff changes, but its still good to know the configuration you started with.

Ch

Quote from: Smitty –
A quick with to confirm if it's a Pre DPF ISX600 (Also nicknamed 'Dirty' and as FYI, it should have the CM870 configuration engine build. DPF era 'Clean' ISX600's, will be a CM871 build.) - is to look at the back passenger side basement bays. If you have two behind the Tag, it's Pre DPF. If you have one large basement bay, it's CM871. IF it's a CM871, I personally would negotiate a price to allow the pro-active upgraded Head Replacement at a Cummins Shop. This could go from the $15-20K range, depending upon local shop hour rates, and also items being replaced at the same time as the head swap out. (Which is not a bad idea, as the labor of tearing down and getting the head off, makes replacing any recommended or questionable other components a great time to do so:)!) The new heads are so far handling the dripping slide/crud into the number 6 (And sometimes number 5.) valves, causing erosion and eventually failure.. Costly when this happens. And IMO, a quality good condition Magna or Affinity, is well worth investing the funds into to set it up for the long haul. Heck, say it's a $225K purchase, and you end up doing some new owner modifications and engine head swap and put $40K into it. NOTHING on the market new, for $265K, will be near the quality of these coaches. ---- The Affinity has flush mounted windows, which along with custom paint scheme, sets it apart from the Magna. The flush mounted windows are cool, but can be problematic and more expensive to maintain over the years ahead. Look carefully around all windows, below all windows, for any signs of leaking and possible de-lamination. And for signs of fogging. Fogging can be repaired, but more expensive for the flush mounted windows. And when you buy that coach, or any CC coach for that matter. Being your first one, you will have a steep learning curve. So plan to stay at the place your purchasing it, or near it, for a few days. Go thru the systems, read the manuals, ask questions here and on Face Book CC pages (Worth joining.) - and keep asking the place that you bought it follow-up questions as they come up. And I do recommend RV Driving School for new large coach owner's, it's a small amount, insurance discount too, and it will greatly accelerate your comfort level while driving, and navigating in RV Parks:)! Best of luck to you. - Smitty

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #5 –
Doug,

HIRE AN OUTSIDE INSPECTOR TO PDI THE COACH. I cannot stress this enough.

I spent 2 years researching coaches while waiting to retire. I just bought a Magna from Premier RV (Damon Rapozo). I regret not having an outside inspector do a complete Pre Delivery Inspection (PDI). I trusted that Premier had done one, but it was clear they hadn't even after I was told a PDI was done and no issues were found. ALL RV's will have repair items after a PDI. I arrived to pick up my coach and quickly found several basic items had issues (Windshield wipers were junk, batteries were junk, etc) My coach was a consignment and I should have at least negotiated new batteries with the consignor. I don't say these things to beat up on Premier, because they really DID treat me right. I say this to show you that even the #1 CC shop in the world will miss things. Get that PDI done before you buy! 

Please do your research on an Affinity. Like others have said, each model has its own little quirks. Affinity windows are an issue and leak. Ask if the windows have been updated (which is a lengthy and expensive upgrade). Get proof. As Smitty said, the ISX engines do have head problems. I was zoned in on buying a 2009 Magna with an ISX650 and passed on it after I did some research and the seller had no proof of update. I don't have rich guy money to throw $30k at a head repair. I opted for the CAT C-13 525hp. I climbed the Siskyou's and Grapevine on the the way home. Had no issues with needing more power. C-13 is a bulletproof engine.

The last thing I will say about buying an Affinity as your first RV. It's comparable to getting your private pilots license in a Boeing 747.
2006 Country Coach Magna Rembrandt

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #6 –
When did CC stop using CAT engines in the Magna and the Affinity?

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #7 –
I guess I don't understand why "they" say the inverters should be replaced. Sounds like someone doesn't know how the inverters workr set them up.
'02 Intrigue #11427

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #9 –
Quote from: Smitty –
A quick with to confirm if it's a Pre DPF ISX600 (Also nicknamed 'Dirty' and as FYI, it should have the CM870 configuration engine build. DPF era 'Clean' ISX600's, will be a CM871 build.) - is to look at the back passenger side basement bays. If you have two behind the Tag, it's Pre DPF.
It has two doors, so that seems good.

Quote
And IMO, a quality good condition Magna or Affinity, is well worth investing the funds into to set it up for the long haul. Heck, say it's a $225K purchase, and you end up doing some new owner modifications and engine head swap and put $40K into it. NOTHING on the market new, for $265K, will be near the quality of these coaches.
I've looked at a lot of stuff online and I'm impressed by what I've seen and heard!

Quote
And when you buy that coach, or any CC coach for that matter. Being your first one, you will have a steep learning curve. So plan to stay at the place your purchasing it, or near it, for a few days. Go thru the systems, read the manuals, ask questions here and on Face Book CC pages (Worth joining.) - and keep asking the place that you bought it follow-up questions as they come up.
We're lucky that this coach is at a local repair shop right here in Tucson, so that adds quite a bit of confidence!

Thanks Smitty!
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #10 –
Quote from: CamDaddy –
The last thing I will say about buying an Affinity as your first RV. It's comparable to getting your private pilots license in a Boeing 747.
Wow, LOL, I like it.  Why fly a Cessna when you can fly a Boeing?
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #11 –
General update: my wife and I visited Olstrom's for the third time yesterday.  On the first visit we had just looked at the coach, on the second visit they put chassis batteries in it and we tried to go for a ride, but it acted up and we had to limp along at 20 mph.  Eric rescued us and we had a really good discussion about everything.  (I believe the solution was that they put new fuel filters in.  I think this coach had been sitting for some months...)

During this visit we each got to drive the coach.  Eric seemed surprised that this was my first time ever driving something like this.  I was really comfortable with it from the start and it didn't take my wife very long to settle in to driving it too.

They're going to include new house batteries, new tires, and a new digital dash, along with the new chassis batteries in the purchase price.  We're going to pay for a new set of shades in the front window and the front sides.  If I understand correctly, the current inverters work fine, but are an older model that may need to be replaced (I think with a different brand) at some point.

The only gripes I have about this coach are that I would prefer a better sofa bed in case we have our son and his girlfriend along with us, and, since I'm 6'5", I wish the bed was a king instead of a queen.  Not a show stopper though, everything else is fantastic!

60f8dc60d9744a5203449e15.jpg
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #12 –
Beautiful coach!
2006 Country Coach Magna Rembrandt

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #13 –
Well, it's been a long process, but the Affinity is now ours.

Turns out the bed is actually a short California King.  (I'm very happy about that!)  We found out when we were putting the queen size sheets on and they weren't wide enough...

60f8dc61e7414d61fc4c9063.jpg60f8dc9d5f04d55fae7bd933.jpg60f8dcc0f955a34718551644.jpg
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #14 –
Congrats on the new coach. It does have the 'Clean' CM871  configuration ISX600, which being DPF and EGR combined, is a higher probability engine for problems with #6 (Sometimes #5 too.) valve drops/erosion. Here's three options to consider: 1) Do nothing and go drive and maintain it, and fingers crossed no valve drop; 2) On your schedule, and at the place you want the work done. Pro Actively have the head replaced with the new improved alloy materials. And while the head is off, any other items that they find that could use attention. 3) Buy a good quality Extended Warranty, and their very few of those, and make sure it has rider/optional coverage for when a Non Covered Part, takes out a Covered Part - that the Covered Part is, well, covered. (Many EW's will use a wiggle effect to sidestep a claim, if they find say one 'Excluded' covered parts, takes out a part that is covered.).

My intent is to not cause you grief, and it is only my opinion. You sound like you have a good relationship with Eric, and he has a great reputation. So run these options by him for his input.

And I apologize for not checking back into this thread earlier, and for not being clearer in my earlier post. The Single Door 'Dirty' CM870 Configuration, is the ISX600 with the least risk of a problem from valve's dropping. I missed you post, where you stated it had the 'Two Doors' until a few minutes ago.

And I stand by my earlier input. These coaches are worth the investment... Hard to find this quality at these used price points - and these rigs when well maintained, will be very solid and soon timeless classics... Heck, sort of a Duesenburg of the Class A's:)! 

Keep the rubber side down, and have fun,
Smitty
04 Allure Sold to a nice new owner! Now enjoying a 07 Magna Rembrandt 45' ISX600 #6775
"We're ONDROAD for THEJRNY!" (Toad and Coach license plates, say Hi if you see us!)

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #15 –
I created an account at Cummins.com and put in the serial number of the engine in this coach.  According to Cummins, this is a CM870.  If I'm reading things correctly, it has 600 HP and 1850 Ft-Lbs of torque.

Thanks...
2008 Affinity Saint Helena

Re: Potential new owner here. What do you wish you had known before you bought?

Reply #16 –
Thanks for letting me know about it being the Dirty CM870!

Just goes to show that 'tribal internet lore', should always be fact checked!!!! (And whenever I post about the simple way to 'usually' tell the difference between a Clean vs Dirty ISX600, I'll add in the word 'Usually'  about the two doors vs single door, and have them do what you did - call Cummins with the specific Serial Number to get the CM870 vs CM871 Config info...)

Best to you,
Smitty
04 Allure Sold to a nice new owner! Now enjoying a 07 Magna Rembrandt 45' ISX600 #6775
"We're ONDROAD for THEJRNY!" (Toad and Coach license plates, say Hi if you see us!)