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Factory Service

Yahoo Message Number: 9126
Hi All, just wondering how many of you good folks take your coaches to the factory for service? Do you go for regular maintenance schedule or problems that occur, or both? Thanks, Larry

Re: Factory Service

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 9127
Larry:

Whenever I am in the area, JC is the best place to go. The only exception would be Cumins/Onan service, then it is Coach Care in Coburg.
Sometimes, depending on how booked CC is, they will send you to places such as Carrier and Sons. Another fine outfit.

Chuck

03 Intrigue 11673

Re: Factory Service

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 9134
Beaudry and Lasydays have Country Coach people on site, plus there's the factory. No one else for me , accepting Cummins and Allison. TWI 11731

Re: Factory Service

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 9135
-Thanks for the replies, I was thinking that the schedule and turn around time might be a problem at the CC factory, guess not. Thanks again, larry

Re: Factory Service

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 9151
When in JC don't forget Carrier & Sons. We've found they can't be beat.

Tom

02 Intrigue

Re: Factory Service

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 9155
--Tom, what type of service does Carrier & Son offer? I knocked around JC for a week and don't recall seeing their business.
Larry

Factory Service

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 11554
I recently had the misfortune to spend nearly a month @ the factory getting repairs made that were mostly minor and should have taken a week.

The most troubling aspect of the experience was that I found the service writers acting more as gate keepers (to avoid making proper repairs) than as advocates. They seemed to interfere with the technicians doing the job (this was true also with paint and body work farmed out to Guaranty technicians). I understand Jay Howard is somewhat aware of the service problems but alas they remain.
I was planning on moving up to an '06 Intrigue (the new body style), but

I'm not so sure any longer.

I've heard several CC employees state that customers gripe, but keep buying Country Coaches.

Is there any effort by CCI members to see that this situation is corrected?
Michael

'04 Inspire Genoa 40'

Re: Factory Service

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 11559
Michael, I suggest owners of all brands of coaches gripe from time top time. The reason people keep buying CC's is overall quality and driving comfort.
If you see a trend developing re lack of service at the factory you should talk to Doug Rutherford who heads up that function. I have found Doug to act fairly and promptly to solve problems.

Walt Rothermel
03Allure30811

Re: Factory Service

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 11560
I agree, but how do you get to actually speak with Doug Rutherford? From time to time we've had issues that require help, but Doug is never "available to take my call"? Suggestions Walt?
And from what I've heard, if you think CC is bad try going with some other manufacturer.
I agree that none are perfect, but CC products are far and away superior in quality and drivability to anything in similar price ranges on the market.

Tom

2002 Intrigue - 36' Double Slide - Currently for sale to purchase 05 Magna for full-timing.

Re: Factory Service

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 11571
If you can't reach Doug by phone e-mail him at drutherford @.... He travels quite a bit but has always contacted me in short order.

Walt Rothermel
03Allure30811

Re: Factory Service

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25353
  One reason we purchased our first CC was the availability of service at the factory on the west coast that (at the time) was only two days drive away from home.
 
    It isn't always perfect and sometimes takes longer then we expect but the support we have received is great compared to our prior "SOB" motor home and a lousy dealer that was only an hour from home.
 
    Availability of parts is much better and if necessary the service guys can interface directly with the engineers and designers.
 
    When trying to understand my fuel problem I was able to take the factory tour specifically to see how the fuel tank, feed tubes and sensor were installed on the chassis line and even talked to the guy doing the job.  Very informative.  Try that at a dealer!
 
    If you are across country and miles from JC there is not much option but to use a local dealer but don't knock the factory service guys.
 
    That said, service on engines and generators is best left to the authorized engine shops IMHO and in that respect Cummins NW in Coburg has performed well for us.
 
    David
 
David and Karen (and a very spoiled tuxedo, aka Kat)
2006 Allure Siskiyou 31383
2002 Honda Odyssey TOAD

Re: Factory Service

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25362
To All:

I would like to have tried the factory service, but my brand new 2006 Inspire 360 never made delivery to me on 7/22/2006. We knew after a turbo blew and fire in the engine compartment, that the coach had some serious flaws and intended to take it to the factory to have them make it right. It hasn't been operable and safe since we bought it and anxiously awaited delivery on 7/22.
Each time a Cat Service Center thinks its fixed, we pick it up and drive it a short distance towards home in Southern California and something mechanical breaks down again. Mostly it is due to overheating which on several occasions Caterpillar says is a CC design or engineering problem. Now CC finally believes it is fixed, but damage from towing, paint scraped off on one side from being shuffled in and out of repair bays and slide problems still prevent us from enjoying our new coach we have owned and never used for over 2 months.
It is now (for the past 10 days) in the CC authorized repair shop to have these things (damage) repaired. Since we haven't had a chance to use it, we really don't know what works inside the coach and what doesn't. Still smells new the few times we have visited it, but it is taking on a slightly lemon odor.
I bought a CC because I had heard so much about the quality, service, design and engineering. It's pretty and CC has never failed to attempt to patch and repair it, but its not showing me anything else.
An angry, disappointed new owner who paid handsomely for a new toy that's broken, patched and repatched..

Doris

2006 Inspire 360.......and if I actually got to take a trip in the coach for a few days, I'd probably know what the coach number was.

Re: Factory Service

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25374
David and Karen,

We have used Cummins Coach Care and so far they are great to work with as a CCI authorized repair center. Plus, as you pointed out the generator and engine are best left to the specialists

PS-Looks like we are about 28 coaches apart!

Mike.

Mike and Janet (And two Golden Retreivers) 2006 Allure Siskiyou 31335 2005 Ford Escape Toad

Re: Factory Service

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25379
We've had good luck at the factory. They redid the repairs that Beaudry RV in Tucson screwed up. For engine work we take our CAT to Peterson Machinery in Eugene or Western States Equipment in Boise.
Our plan is to make a list of issues and visit Junction City/Eugene once a year to get our service done. I do agree that getting a relationship with a factory team makes a big difference.

Bob

'05 Intrigue 11872

Re: Factory Service

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25381
CC has eliminated the service writers. Now you work directly with the service team. The guys who pick up the coach in the morning and bring it back at night are the same ones doing the service.

Bob

Re: Factory Service

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25388
Would you have had to take delivery of this coach? I'm not even talking specifically about this one but what if your coach was being delivered to the dealer and it was in an accident? Are you able to say you don't want that coach and order/purchase another one? I don't even want tree branches to scratch mine. I'd be royally upset if my brand new coach had been scraped at a service place. I guess I'm asking what the legal aspects are.

Pati Mah

2005 Allure #31287

Re: Factory Service

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25395
Hi Pati Mah

Thanks for showing concern about our CC nightmare. Actually the coach made it from the factory to the dealer, but the dealer was probably aware it was one of the Inspires that had an overheating problem. If it had totally broken down prior to delivery to the dealer, it would have been CC's problem to begin with. I had heard this has happened to dealers occasionally and that's the way it's handled.
When we purchased it from the dealer we were told the temp gauges for the cooling system and transmission will run high, but we should just ignore it. We were also told that the Caterpillar C-9 400 has a fail safe system and will give us an engine light warning at 220, derate and shut down at 223. We were given great assurances the dealer was number 1 in service for CC and CC customer support was the best in the RV industry.
We had started our 2 month planned trip with our tow vehicle and were having the Inspire delivered to us when it was detailed and ready on 7/22. While excitedly awaiting delivery, we received a call from the retired truck driver who was driving it from the dealers to us. He was 45 minutes from us, but there was fire and black smoke out the exhaust, he had experienced high temperatures on a grade and downshifted, it continued overheating and at 220 degrees the engine warning light came on and that's when the blow up occurred. He was upset because he called the dealer and instead of receiving support, he received blame for manually downshifting. He was blamed for causing the breakdown. We were in the middle.
This would have been our 6th RV so we were not ignorant about grades and downshifting. We knew the Allison transmission automatically downshifted at certain temperatures and we knew manual downshifting was a normal way to drive these rigs also.
We received a call from the dealer telling us thru driver error, the coach was broken down on the side of the road, but it was just a blown air hose or something and would be fixed the next business day. He had already arranged with a Caterpillar Service company to fix it ASAP. It would be ready at noon on Monday. CC was aware of the problem as well as Cat and they were pushing to have everything taken care of. Either he or CC would pay our hotel bill. Stay and wait for delivery. We already knew it was something more serious than an air hose due to the driver's honesty. He'd looked under the hood (so to speak) and knew there had been a fire in the engine compartment, suspected it was a blown turbocharger, melted brake lines, air hose, wiring and more. However, we did not want to confront the dealer's attempt to soften the issue, we just wanted it fixed, we were committed to this long trip and we were meeting over 100 people at a family reunion thousands of miles away; our appearance would have been a first for the family and they were excited to see us.
Monday rolled around and no status. Finally in the late afternoon we started checking around and found that the coach was still sitting in a storage lot 45 minutes away from the Caterpillar service. Also the Caterpillar service had not heard anything about this vehicle and if it did ever arrive for repairs, it would not even be looked at for several business days. They were swamped.
We called the dealer with a 'hey, what's happening' question. He called us back and told us our coach should be ready for pick up, it was just an air hose as he said. Why he did this I have no idea, but we told him what we knew so far. At that point we told him we had not taken delivery of the coach yet, follow thru on the repairs, keep us informed and we are heading home. We hung up the phone.
This is when the dealer said something quite shocking to us. He called back on our cell line and said I know why you were taking out of state delivery, it is to avoid paying sales taxes and because of this, I consider you have taken delivery or else. He left this message on our service since we were busy making calls on our cell phone informing family we probably wouldn't make it. We were too stunned to respond to this call. This only made us more resolved to walk away from the coach.
We saved this recording and relayed it to the dealers supervisor, and eventually to our first contact with CC. I say eventually because we heard from no one for several days after this regarding the coach. Finally we called CC, no one in the service department or otherwise had heard about this. We called Cat tech support, no record of a call from the dealer on this coach existed. We called back CC and relayed our plight and that we will not take delivery of this coach, we want our money back. We relayed the recording to explain why our communications had broken down with the dealer. We submitted our two day hotel lodging bill to CC and the dealer. No promise of reimbursement was made by the CC rep.
After this, we started receiving calls and conference calls between CC and Caterpillar technical support assuring us it was a one in a million shot that the turbo would fail, etc. We spent hours on the phone over a two week period of time listening to number one in customer support and quality pitches from CC and one in a million assurances from Cat. We were encouraged to take delivery, CC would take care of us.
We attempted to cancel the entire transaction, we put a stop payment on the 50% down payment. Then we attempted to cancel the loan and we were told that we were on the hook for the loan amount no matter what.....period. Financially, the coach was ours.
We really liked the CC more than any other coach we looked at and believed the one in a million pitch. We accepted delivery. Several days later the coach was finally fixed and ready. Almost three weeks later we picked up the repaired coach, if we picked up supplies from home and drove in shifts straight through we could still make the reunion. Our two or three month road trip was back on and we were happy campers. We drove 120 miles when the transmission failed due to overheating and melting wires and sensors. We limped home and took the coach to the truck service CC recommended. Weeks later, CC did a patch/repair to the issue by using heat wraps that every truck mechanic I've spoken with has said will only last a few years due to the extreme, abnormal heat in the engine compartment. To replace the patch in a few years will be thousands of dollars to do. Every mechanic volunteered this as a CC hot weather problem, especially driving on grades.
There are some who feel a few thousand dollars for a chronic repair due to an engineering flaw with CC is chicken feed. I can afford it and am sure I will be able to pay this and more several years down the line. However, I did not get in my financial position by having this attitude. I am not frugal, but I am not foolish about spending unnecessarily either. I paid for a quality, well engineered machine and I expected to receive one.
We started checking around more to see if CC is having quality control or engineering problems. Our one in a million experience was not true. We have a very thick file on this research.
All together it has been in repairs for two months, the last week or so it is repairs from towing damage, etc. as I mentioned. It is still in the shop. We contacted several lawyers and it does indeed qualify under the lemon law.
Most people I have told this story to, including service people have volunteered that CC should at the very least pay the initial hotel bill and offer some compensation for what we have been through. I relayed this to CC in an attempt to be reimbursed for the initial breakdown lodging costs for two days. We received an offer to extend the initial warranty several weeks and they'd look into the hotel reimbursement issue.
CC has honored the warranty work and been nothing but pleasant to us. I must say this about the company, their PR is number one. At this point, that's all I can say about it. Having made a career of sales, I have seen other salesmen sell the worst product at the best price through good verbal skills and PR.

Angry and Still waiting for my Lemon.

Doris Stephens,

New 2006 Inspire 360 No.?

Re: Factory Service

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25405
Jim:

I don't mind answering your question. It is McMahon RV in Stanton California. It is a relatively new branch of the Irvine based dealership and the newly hired manager did the repair work UN follow-up or is that foul up........
I note you have an Allure. When I was told the one in a million tale about the Turbo charger fault during a conference call with CC and Cat, CC piped in they've only had an Allure have this problem recently. Its unheard of on an Inspire.

Doris

Re: Factory Service

Reply #19 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25406
Do you find it interesting that your driver got an engine warning light and not an engine overheat light? The engine warning light can be any number of problems not necessarily related to heat.
The engine o/h (water temp) light deals with those temps that you mentioned.
Well, let me tell you I think that all the Inspires (with the C9) run far hotter than they should.
I used to get the o/h light on my coach and the country coach fix was to snip the wire to the light. Country Coach has since disabled all the o/h lights on the 2005 Inspires and probably beyond. If you have the temp light on your dash cluster its probably just a dummy light with no wiring.
Nothing wrong with your driver.

The Inspire is definitely a work in progress for Country Coach.
Nobody, deserves the kinds of problems that you have had with your coach.
Best of luck
Jim

2005 40' Inspire #51225

Re: Factory Service

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25408
Jim:

I was always curious about why the warning light did not come on for us at 220 and shut down at 223 during the 120 mile stretch we took while attempting the long trip. We were told by the dealer our coach was set for this warning temps.
We certainly exceeded those temperatures and that was not on a grade, but in hot weather. We called Caterpiller's Technical support hotline since it was after hours and CC tech support wasn't available. Caterpiller told us the light should have come on as a factory default unless it was disabled via owner choice. Some people don't like that feature on the C9 because they do a lot of city driving. (We'd been told our was set for this). Caterpiller also told me that the coach should not be running anywhere near the temperatures I was running even on a grade. Especially since my coach was not yet loaded with any personal effects, the tanks were empty and only had a half a tank of fuel. I asked for and received Cat's recommended cooling system temperature ranges in writing and relayed this to CC.
Their response was that the gauge could be off by 4%, so since it was still in the shop for the second blow up, I asked for the gauge accuracy to be checked. It was and I was told it was right on, but I was also told that a 4% inaccuracy would only amount to a degree or two either way. Still not enough to consider it not being an overheating problem. CC asked us if we wanted to have a Silverleaf installed. Again, I pointed out I am not focused on the gauges, rather I am fixated on the safety, reliability and long term use of the coach which an overheating problem and temporary fix gives me some doubt about.
You are right about the Inspire. While waiting for repairs, I did some further checking with several diesel mechanics and the consensus of opinion is that CC has a problem with the Inspire running too hot, blown turbos and burnt up wiring is more common than one would think. Every diesel engine repair facility I went to had at least one Inspire in for similar problems to mine. Everyone called the heat wraps a temporary band aid. One suggested in this model CC's radiator and fan need to be bigger to accommodate the additional heat the 05 and 06 and probably the 07's are receiving from the EPA modifications (catalytic converter, etc.) they probably made. Almost to a man, everyone's opinion was if they were buying a coach, they would not buy an Inspire.
Now CC has released a new model, less expensive I believe. I wonder if this problem will carry onto this new line.

Doris.

Re: Factory Service

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25423
Oh I was afraid of that, I bought my Allure at McMahon's in Irvine , and telling the truth is not one of their long suits. I went in knowing what I thought was the bottom line, but now I am worried. My unit A/C failed and the Hot water systems leaks. I was told the A/C gets let out on a subcontract, and they will just tear apparent the heater until they find the leak. Oh yes the same routine leave it with us for a couple of weeks. Hmmm I don't know. I hope you issue work out.

Re: Factory Service

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25425
I refuse to use McMahon in Irvine or Stanton for service for this very reason, they do boldly lie. When we picked out the coach and did our initial walk thru we pointed out things that needed to be done, they said it had just come from the factory and hadn't been detailed. One compartment door was hanging over a half inch lower than the rest and if that couldn't be adjusted we wanted them to take a picture and press CC for repairing or replacing it. It really looked tacky. They trotted out with their cute little digital cameras and appeared to be taking a picture.
We came back for our orientation and nothing was done, they claimed they did it all. We went down the list which included a shower that leaked and flooded the floor and a bathroom door that wouldn't latch. The compartment door was still hanging low, so we asked if they contacted CC about it and they assured us CC said they'd take care of it at the factory. We planned on incorporating a factory trip in our long vacation. So, we had to go thru a third walk thru to get them to do the things they promised to do.
The first time we talked to CC during the break down fiasco, we asked CC about the compartment door and they had heard nothing from McMahon about this. No digital picture, nothing. Just like McMahon never alerted CC service to the initial breakdown as they said they did.
McMahon pitched us with their being voted number one for service last year from CC. CC had heard enough from us to know they should not suggest we go back to McMahon in Stanton or Irvine for service. McMahon opened a new and larger service facility in Colton that appears to be run better, maybe more honestly. In any event they could put us in a service bay immediately. We took our coach there for the compartment door, battery problem, slide problem, warped from towing problem, bathroom door swinging both ways problem, paint scraped off down the length of one side from being shuffled around repair bays and other cosmetic things, so the jury is still out on whether they truly run their service better. They've had it for almost two weeks now.
At this stage, I don't know if things can be worked out it is just one thing after another and CC still hasn't gotten to the root of the overheating problems..

Doris

Re: Factory Service

Reply #23 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25445
When I am at Church I wonder how an organization like McMahon's can remain in business. I know they have hired and bought almost the whole back half of Traveland. They have hired all of the saddleback personnel from service to technicians, and yet nothing has changed. You would think that in shear numbers progress would be inevitable. I know that CC home service has improved, and I thinking about just making the factory trip for the warranty work I have. My salesman Chris Holland does not call anymore, as I could not get them to quote on the additional work I wanted done before delivery. I should have known better, and my excuse is the unit I got was the last of 37' 2006 in CA. If I can be of any help just e-mail me direct and I will give you my phone number. In the mean time let me know if I can be of any service.

Re: Factory Service

Reply #24 –
Yahoo Message Number: 25454
It's amazing how the salesmen disappear before the ink dries. Our experience with McMahon and their receiving CC's best service award just demonstrates the dollar is #1. By McMahon's expansion, they have become a business to be wooed by CC in spite of their lack of customer service and follow through.
I dealt with this hypocracy by writing a letter to CC and telling them of my nightmare experience with McMahon and playing the nasty recording in which threats and intimidation were used to intimidate us into taking delivery of a broken down motorhome. I'm sure my letter was round filed, but if CC gets enough complaints, maybe they will listen.
Thank you so much for your offer of help! If you or others had similar mechanical problems with your C9 400 CC, whatever year, it would help me to know about it.

Doris

Lemon 2006 Un-Inspire 360