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Drivers License

Yahoo Message Number: 10322
The same ignorance applies to driver licensing laws. Most people try to tell you that you don't need a special drivers license to drive a motorhome. The FACT is that's wrong in many states!

Last I had heard, about 24 states had re-written their driver licensing laws to follow the new federal guidelines published about 3 years ago. I'll use Pennsylvania as a good example...

Under the old law... Several years ago, Pennsylvania had just 3 types of drivers licenses: A, B, and C. Class C licenses were for cars, class B for straight trucks over 26,000 pounds and class A for semi-tractor-trailer rigs. Both class B and class A were generally called "CDL" licenses. CDL stands for Commercial Drivers License.

Now, under the new Pennsylvania driver licensing laws (that follow the federal guidelines), Pennsylvania has 2 NEW types of licenses - Class B NON-CDL (Non-Commercial Drivers License) for non-commercial vehicles over 26,000 pounds, and Class A NON-CDL for non-commercial vehicles towing a trailer over 10,000 pounds. Motorhome owners driving rigs that weigh more than 26,000 pounds are required to take a written test of 50 questions and a driving test in their coach to get a Class B Non-Commercial Drivers License. If the RV has air brakes, the driver must also take a 25 question written exam on air brakes and pass the driving test including explaining air brakes and their usage to the examiner.

Fifth wheel owners who pull a 5th wheel that weighs more than 10,000 pounds are now required to have a Class A Non-CDL.
I can recall the day I call the PA DOT and asked them "If I needed a CDL to drive my 26,000 pound motorhome?" And they told me "No, RVs are exempt from CDL since they are not used commercially". The problem is I didn't ask the right question!!!! So I called back and asked "If I could use a class C license to drive a 26,000 pound motorhome or did I need a special license of some kind?" and the answer I got that time was, "YES, you do need a Class B Non-CDL".

Just like the 20,000 pound federal axle limitation, many folks just try to ignore the law, stick their heads in the sand, and hope they don't get caught. Since ~50% of the states now have new driver licensing laws, the wise and prudent RV owner should understand the laws in their state and determine if they are operating their RV within the law.

When you call your state DOT, be sure you talk to somebody who knows the latest law changes regarding RV drivers licenses and be sure to ask the right questions!

Hope this helps keep a few of you out of trouble.

Regards,

Bob Kumza

Re: Drivers License

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10357
From the volume of responses on this web site, it seems like there are lots of people concerned about weight safety, but no one concerned if they have the correct drivers license to drive their motorhome. With almost half the states now requiring a special license (an upgrade from a car drivers license) for coaches over 26,000 lbs, I would have expected lots of discussion on this important issue.

Doesn't anyone else have a concern on this issue?

Maybe you could check with your state DOT and post your states license regulations here so others could learn from your experience.

Regards,

Bob Kumza

Quote from: rvrobert2003
> The same ignorance applies to driver licensing laws. Most people > try to tell you that you don't need a special drivers license to > drive a motorhome. The FACT is that's wrong in many states! >

Last I had heard, about 24 states had re-written their driver > licensing laws to follow the new federal guidelines published

about

Quote
3 years ago. I'll use Pennsylvania as a good example...

Under the old law... Several years ago, Pennsylvania had just 3 > types of drivers licenses: A, B, and C. Class C licenses were for > cars, class B for straight trucks over 26,000 pounds and class A

for

Quote
semi-tractor-trailer rigs. Both class B and class A were

generally

Quote
called "CDL" licenses. CDL stands for Commercial Drivers

License.

Quote
>

Now, under the new Pennsylvania driver licensing laws (that follow > the federal guidelines), Pennsylvania has 2 NEW types of licenses -

Class B NON-CDL (Non-Commercial Drivers License) for non-

commercial

Quote
vehicles over 26,000 pounds, and Class A NON-CDL for non-

commercial

Quote
vehicles towing a trailer over 10,000 pounds. Motorhome owners > driving rigs that weigh more than 26,000 pounds are required to

take

Quote
a written test of 50 questions and a driving test in their coach

to

Quote
get a Class B Non-Commercial Drivers License. If the RV has air > brakes, the driver must also take a 25 question written exam on

air

Quote
brakes and pass the driving test including explaining air brakes

and

Quote
their usage to the examiner.

Fifth wheel owners who pull a 5th wheel that weighs more than

10,000

Quote
pounds are now required to have a Class A Non-CDL.

I can recall the day I call the PA DOT and asked them "If I needed

a

Quote
CDL to drive my 26,000 pound motorhome?" And they told me "No,

RVs

Quote
are exempt from CDL since they are not used commercially". The > problem is I didn't ask the right question!!!! So I called back

and

Quote
asked "If I could use a class C license to drive a 26,000 pound > motorhome or did I need a special license of some kind?" and the > answer I got that time was, "YES, you do need a Class B Non-CDL".

Just like the 20,000 pound federal axle limitation, many folks

just

Quote
try to ignore the law, stick their heads in the sand, and hope

they

Quote
don't get caught. Since ~50% of the states now have new driver > licensing laws, the wise and prudent RV owner should understand

the

Quote
laws in their state and determine if they are operating their RV > within the law.

When you call your state DOT, be sure you talk to somebody who

knows

Quote
the latest law changes regarding RV drivers licenses and be sure

to

Re: Drivers License

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10358
Well, I was concerned enough to check NJ and apparently the only thing I don't need a license for (they're trying to institute a boat license) is my MH. Just curious... my understanding has been that relatively few states require an enhanced license. Since there is a "pretty big" difference between "relatively few" and "almost half", could you identify the states with a requirement or the source of your statement?

Thanks,
Dave

'98 Allure #30187

Quote from: rvrobert2003

Re: Drivers License

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10360
Bob, my state, WA., does not require any endorsement or different license, that will probably change if the numbers of MH grow and the state sees another source of revenue.
Not sure where I saw a list, *I'll look some more, of those states that require a different license to operate a MH. The 2004 Trailer Life Directory has a list of "Big-Rig" license on page 22 . They list : California, Florida, Illinois, Texas. I'm not sure if these states are new addition this year.

*I'll find that publication and post the name.
Larry

'99 Affinity

Re: Drivers License

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10361
Texas has an enhanced license.

Barry

Quote from: tandemsince83
> Well, I was concerned enough to check NJ and apparently the only

thing

Quote
I don't need a license for (they're trying to institute a boat > license) is my MH. Just curious... my understanding has been that > relatively few states require an enhanced license. Since there is a > "pretty big" difference between "relatively few" and "almost half", > could you identify the states with a requirement or the source of

your

Quote
statement?

Thanks,
Dave

'98 Allure #30187

[quote author=rvrobert2003"

> From the volume of responses on this web site, it seems like

there

Quote
are lots of people concerned about weight safety, but no one > > concerned if they have the correct drivers license to drive their > > motorhome. With almost half the states now requiring a special > > license (an upgrade from a car drivers license) for coaches over > > 26,000 lbs, I would have expected lots of discussion on this > > important issue.
>

> Doesn't anyone else have a concern on this issue? > >

> Maybe you could check with your state DOT and post your states > > license regulations here so others could learn from your

experience.

Quote

> Regards,
>

> Bob Kumza
>
>

[quote author=rvrobert2003"
>]
> > The same ignorance applies to driver licensing laws. Most people > > > try to tell you that you don't need a special drivers license to > > > drive a motorhome. The FACT is that's wrong in many states! > > >

> > Last I had heard, about 24 states had re-written their driver > > > licensing laws to follow the new federal guidelines published > > about

> > 3 years ago. I'll use Pennsylvania as a good example...
> >

> > Under the old law... Several years ago, Pennsylvania had just

3

Quote
> types of drivers licenses: A, B, and C. Class C licenses were

for

Quote
> cars, class B for straight trucks over 26,000 pounds and class

A

Quote
for

> > semi-tractor-trailer rigs. Both class B and class A were > > generally

> > called "CDL" licenses. CDL stands for Commercial Drivers > > License.
> >

> > Now, under the new Pennsylvania driver licensing laws (that

follow

Quote
> the federal guidelines), Pennsylvania has 2 NEW types of

licenses -

Quote

> > Class B NON-CDL (Non-Commercial Drivers License) for non- > > commercial

> > vehicles over 26,000 pounds, and Class A NON-CDL for non- > > commercial

> > vehicles towing a trailer over 10,000 pounds. Motorhome owners > > > driving rigs that weigh more than 26,000 pounds are required to > > take

> > a written test of 50 questions and a driving test in their

coach

Quote
to

> > get a Class B Non-Commercial Drivers License. If the RV has

air

Quote
> brakes, the driver must also take a 25 question written exam on > > air

> > brakes and pass the driving test including explaining air

brakes

Quote
and

> > their usage to the examiner.
> >

> > Fifth wheel owners who pull a 5th wheel that weighs more than > > 10,000

> > pounds are now required to have a Class A Non-CDL.
> >

> > I can recall the day I call the PA DOT and asked them "If I

needed

Quote
a

> > CDL to drive my 26,000 pound motorhome?" And they told me "No, > > RVs

> > are exempt from CDL since they are not used commercially". The > > > problem is I didn't ask the right question!!!! So I called back > > and

> > asked "If I could use a class C license to drive a 26,000 pound > > > motorhome or did I need a special license of some kind?" and

the

Quote
> answer I got that time was, "YES, you do need a Class B Non-

CDL".

Quote
>

> > Just like the 20,000 pound federal axle limitation, many folks > > just

> > try to ignore the law, stick their heads in the sand, and hope > > they

> > don't get caught. Since ~50% of the states now have new driver > > > licensing laws, the wise and prudent RV owner should understand > > the

> > laws in their state and determine if they are operating their

RV

Quote
> within the law.
> >

> > When you call your state DOT, be sure you talk to somebody who > > knows

> > the latest law changes regarding RV drivers licenses and be

sure

Re: Drivers License

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10362
Bob,

The Great State of North Carolina requires a class B license for anything over 26,000#. Most people do not know this.

Jim C., Hillsborough, NC
2003 MADP

Re: Drivers License

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10363
Florida requires a Class "D" with endorsements for air brakes for vehicles over 26000 lbs and so equipped

tks
jb

97 Magna

Re: Drivers License

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10365
Texas requires a Class B non-commercial licens when coach is over 26,001 pounds. No air brake endorsement.

Per 95 Affinity

Re: Drivers License

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10368
Bob (or anyone else),

Do you know if California requires a "special" drivers license to drive RV's?

Thanks,
Rick,

Fulltiming in a 2004, 36' Allure, 31018

Re: Drivers License

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10370
Calfornia has a testing requirement for coaches over 40' in length.
The rest of us are safe..so far.

Carol

Re: Drivers License

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10374
Remember to "ask the right question" Rick (see my first posting on this subject if that doesn't ring a bell). Many states do not require a special license to "drive an RV", BUT if your coach is over 26,000 pounds GVWR or you tow a trailer over 10,000 pounds, then there's a very good chance that a special license may be required.

If you want the right answer, you've got to ask the right question.

Regards,

Bob Kumza

Quote from: surfsidebarney@a\.\.\.\[br\
] > Bob (or anyone else),

Do you know if California requires a "special" drivers license to

drive RV's?

Re: Drivers License

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10381
Same goes for good ole California. They require a RV license for 26001# and over. Some people are under a misconception that it is only a 40ft length issue...not true. Your coach can be 20ft long and over 26000# and you haue to tgke the test and have the special DL. A call to Sacremento DMV will answer many questions.

Re: Drivers License

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10384
I just checked the Calif DMV web site. It states a noncommercial driver licence is required for a "housecar" over 40 feet but not over 45 feet. No reference to weight.
see http://www.dmv.ca.gov/dl/dl_info.htm under "How to apply for a noncommercial driver license"

Quote from: Candace and Dale\[br\
Hollick]

Re: Drivers License

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10386
Haven't been following the DL thread to close but....
At the FMCA rally in Indio last year, a CHP code enforcement officer gave a little talk. He stated that no special license is required to drive a "housecar" because of weight. There is the requirement for a special license if the "housecar" is over 40 foot.

Don

'02 Intrigue #11427

Quote from: Candace and Dale Hollick\[br\
]
'02 Intrigue #11427

FMCA info - Drivers License & legal axle weights

Reply #14 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10392
The FMCA website has a table showing some very valuable information by state including legal length, legal combined length of motorhome and toad, legal weight per axle, legal total weight (GVWR), and drivers license type required to drive a motorhome. The table is published every January and is available to FMCA members at:
http://www.fmca.com/fmc2004/janmag/regulations/rvregualtions_04.pdf
Although most states show a 20,000 per axle weight limit, I was surprised to see that some states have a legal axle limitation of only 18,000 lbs per axle, including CT, IL, MI, and NH!

I learn something new everyday!

Bob Kumza

Quote from: dons2346
Haven't been following the DL thread to close but....
At the FMCA rally in Indio last year, a CHP code enforcement

officer

Quote
gave a little talk. He stated that no special license is required

to

Quote
drive a "housecar" because of weight. There is the requirement for

a

Quote
special license if the "housecar" is over 40 foot.

Don

'02 Intrigue #11427

> -

Re: FMCA info - Drivers License & legal axle weights

Reply #15 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10394
From: "rvrobert2003" rkumza@...>

Quote
(snip)
http://www.fmca.com/fmc2004/janmag/regulations/rvregualtions_04.pdf I noticed that, in the above URL, "regulations" was misspelled in its second use, so I tried to find the website with the correct spelling ... and failed. Clicking on the original reference, with the misspelled word, worked! Go figure.

Dick (& Geri) Campagna
'98 36' Intrigue #10571
Mfd: 11/97

Re: FMCA info - Drivers License & legal axle weights

Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10396
Bob -

Great link, thanks!
Dave

'98 Allure #30187

Quote from: rvrobert2003

Re: FMCA info - Drivers License & legal axle weights

Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10397
The FMCA info is interesting and informative.
However, some of the information is not correct. The FMCA info lists a Class B License as a requirement for Michigan.

A Michigan Class "B" License is the drivers license required for a single vehicle over 26,000 lb. However, when I went to the State of Michigan Sec. of State web site, it lists operating a non-commercial Recreational vehicle weighing over 26,000 lb. as exempt from the Class B license. When I called the Michigan State Police Motor Carrier Division, I got the same answer, non-commercial motor homes are exempt.
However, there is a special license endorsement required if you want to pull double trailers. (I saw a Coach towing both a car and a boat out west a few times, but so far not in Michigan)
Dick

2000 Allure
30592

Re: Drivers License (CA, Nev)

Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10398
There is an ambiguity in the California DMV requirements, as it states that with an ordinary Class C licence you can drive ANY "housecar".

But then they proceed to state that if your vehicle (not housecar) ways more than 26,000 pounds, you need a class B (non commercial), or when your "housecar" is between 40 and 45 ft.
They're probably implying that you cannot drive a housecar longer than 45 ft, also I could make a case that you can with a Class C license.

To get unconfused, I went to the DMV office in Santa Clara, and the manager said I was the first person to ever ask for a Class B non-commercial license (and he did not know how to get me one).
Luckily, I have a class-B from Nevada, where the rules are better described and less ambiguous (and the class B is needed there for my 2000 Magna).

One a side note, why can't these people call a motorhome a motorhome, just like every body else does?

Quote from: Candace and Dale Hollick\[br\
]

Re: Drivers License

Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10403
Don't know where you got your information, Ray. Texas DOES require the class B nonCDL for motorhomes over 26,001#. For trailers/5th wheels, etc. over 26,001 I think it is a class C non CDL.

Ree

Current location---Victoria, TX

2003 Allure 30852

Home is www.eldoradoranch.com near www.sanfelipe.com.mx

Re: Drivers License (CA, Nev)

Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10404
Thanks for all the responses to my question concerning Calif. driver's license requirements for RV's. It sounds like I'm okay for the moment ... I'm probably going to change my state of residence since I don't spend much time in Calif. now. When I choose a new state of residence, I will look into driver license requirements for that given state.

Thanks again,
Rick,

Fulltiming in a 2004, 36' Allure, 31018

Re: Drivers License

Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10458
Bob,

I can tell you that in florida and SC RVs are exempt from needing a CDL regardless of weight as long as the coach is for private use. I have seen the regulations. I can't tell you about other states but I can tell you what several insurance agents at an FMCA show said about this issue. It is something that no one in the RV industry wants to address because it would disrupt sales. I asked an agent what would happen if I were from a state that required a CDL and I had a wreck without a CDL. All the agents I talked with said they would pay the claim. Their example was that they would pay the claims from a DWI wreck also. Then they would raise the rates.
I think this is an industry wide problem that will someday be addressed as coaches get bigger and bigger and we get older and older. I also think as more driving regulations are put on truckers they will put pressure on us to go in weight stations and have CDLs. Why should truckers be the only ones who need a CDL to drive a 50,000 pound vehicle? The only thing saving us right now is our good driving record.
Bill G. 2001 Magna #5998, Soon to be the owner of a 2005 Magna, but only a 40 footer with 3 slides. 45 foot with 4 slides is to big and heavy.

Re: Drivers License

Reply #23 –
Yahoo Message Number: 10459
Larry,

Florida is listed as one of the states that requires a special lisence but when I went to motor vehicles I found that this list was wrong. I don't know who wrote that list. Everyone needs to check their own state in person.

Bill g. 2001 Magna #5998