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House Battery debate

Yahoo Message Number: 22934
The question of batteries is a continual debate. My opinion is that it is a question of how many amp-hours you need. If you are a dedicated boondocker, you need to have a lot of amp-hours, and if that means maintenance of the batteries, so be it. If, on the other hand, you usually are in RV parks hooked up, and only occasionally use the house batteries while overnight at a Wall-mart, then you want long life and maintenance free.
If you are the latter, go with AGM maintenance free batteries (NOT Gelcell).
If you are the former and need amp-hours, the way to go is 6-volt (wet cell) golf cart batteries in a series-parallel configuration. That is the way I have my coach set up. I replaced the four AGM batteries in my coach with six (one located in the space in back of the battery tray) Trojan golf cart batteries, in three parallel banks of two batteries each in series. These batteries are rated at 225 amp-hours each, so when you parallel them by three it gives you 675 amp-hours. This gives me over FOUR KILOWATTS of total usable power from full charge to 50% charge (which is the lowest you should ever discharge your batteries). You won't get that from your AGMs!

Al Colby

2000 Intrigue 10979

Quote from: dutchhe

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22935
Quote
(one located in the space in back of the battery tray) Trojan golf cart >batteries, in three parallel banks of two batteries each in series. These >batteries are rated at 225 amp-hours each, so when you parallel them by >three it gives you 675 amp-hours. This gives me over FOUR KILOWATTS of >total
Peukert's equation would predict that you actually have 225 x 3^1.25 = ~888amphrs.

Think about it this way....if you can draw 10amps for 20hrs from a battery(200ah) then

can draw 5amps for *longer* than 40hrs(>>200ah) from that same battery. This is essentially

what happens when you parallel batteries ....... in your case the current drawn from each

battery drops by ~67% so it's *effective* capacity increases by *greater* than 3X.

Give it some thought and you will see what I mean.
Tom Fisher
Dallas, TX

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22941
Sorry Al, but that is hooey. Lifeline has 6V AGMs at 220 Ah. I've had them all through the years. The absolute worst were Gell Cell.
The absolute best are Lifeline AGMs.
They take a charge better. Hold a charge better. And give back the power better. All without any maintenance and without any off-gas deterioration of the battery compartment.

George in Birmingham
'04 Allure 31038

Quote from: Al Colby

> The question of batteries is a continual debate. My opinion is that

it is a

Quote
question of how many amp-hours you need. If you are a dedicated

boondocker,

Quote
you need to have a lot of amp-hours, and if that means maintenance

of the

Quote
batteries, so be it. If, on the other hand, you usually are in RV

parks

Quote
hooked up, and only occasionally use the house batteries while

overnight at

Quote
a Wall-mart, then you want long life and maintenance free.

If you are the latter, go with AGM maintenance free batteries (NOT

Gelcell).

Quote
>

If you are the former and need amp-hours, the way to go is 6-volt

(wet cell)

Quote
golf cart batteries in a series-parallel configuration. That is the

way I

Quote
have my coach set up. I replaced the four AGM batteries in my coach

with six

Quote
(one located in the space in back of the battery tray) Trojan golf

cart

Quote
batteries, in three parallel banks of two batteries each in series.

These

Quote
batteries are rated at 225 amp-hours each, so when you parallel

them by

Quote
three it gives you 675 amp-hours. This gives me over FOUR KILOWATTS

of total

Quote
usable power from full charge to 50% charge (which is the lowest

you should
George in Birmingham
2003 Magna 6298

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22944
George:

I am not disagreeing that the Lifeline is a better battery. But if I shop around, I can find the Trojan T105 for $90. What are you going to pay for the Lifelines? I am guessing over twice as much. As I said, my thing, as an avid boondocker, is amp-hours. The more the better. I could care less about the fact I have to put water in them once or twice a year. And the other benefits (quicker charge time being the principle one) are not, in my opinion, worth paying 2.5 times the price of the Trojans and getting 5 ah less. And as for how long they last, I had Trojans on my previous coach and they lasted for almost five years (I was careful to never discharge more than 50%). When I got my Intrigue, it had AGMs and they lasted less than four years (my estimate, as they were installed by the previous owner). So I have had AGMs and I have had Trojan T105s, and I prefer Trojan!

But everybody has their opinion!

Al Colby

2000 Intrigue 10979

Quote from: George Sanders

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22975
I'm wondering if you guys could post some photos of how you fit the Trojans and the Lifelines into the existing battery compartment. We do a fair amount of boondocking also and have run into battery discharge and premature failure problems with the 8Hs.

Or if you could email photos to me.

Thanks.

Dan Houck
Allure #30180

Quote from: allan_colby
George:

I am not disagreeing that the Lifeline is a better battery. But if

I

Quote
shop around, I can find the Trojan T105 for $90. What are you

going to

Quote
pay for the Lifelines? I am guessing over twice as much. As I

said, my

Quote
thing, as an avid boondocker, is amp-hours. The more the better. I > could care less about the fact I have to put water in them once or > twice a year. And the other benefits (quicker charge time being

the

Quote
principle one) are not, in my opinion, worth paying 2.5 times the > price of the Trojans and getting 5 ah less. And as for how long

they

Quote
last, I had Trojans on my previous coach and they lasted for

almost

Quote
five years (I was careful to never discharge more than 50%). When

I

Quote
got my Intrigue, it had AGMs and they lasted less than four years

(my

Quote
estimate, as they were installed by the previous owner). So I have

had

Quote
AGMs and I have had Trojan T105s, and I prefer Trojan! >

But everybody has their opinion! >

Al Colby

2000 Intrigue 10979

[quote author=George Sanders"

>

> Sorry Al, but that is hooey. Lifeline has 6V AGMs at 220 Ah.

I've

Quote
had them all through the years. The absolute worst were Gell

Cell.

Quote
The absolute best are Lifeline AGMs.
>

> They take a charge better. Hold a charge better. And give back

the

Quote
power better. All without any maintenance and without any off-

gas

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22981
Look in the photo section and you will find pictures I posted a couple of years ago of my Trojan installation.

Jim Hughes

2000 Allure #30511

Quote from: mainecoons0

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22982
The battery compartment photos are hard to find (nested in albums).
Here are links to a couple of sets which I found in the Photos section of this forum (make sure the whole URL is copied and pasted if it gets split):

http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Country-Coach- Owners/photos/browse/10fc

and another with batteries and inverter change: http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Country-Coach- Owners/photos/view/10fc?b=6
Herb

Forum Moderator

Quote from: mainecoons0

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 22990
I posted the photos showing how I fit my T105's into the battery compartment. The album is "T105 batteries in 200 Intrigue" (meant to type 2000 Intrigue, but skipped a 0). Note that only five will fit in the battery tray. The sixth one needs a new tray constructed and placed in back of the original tray. Due to a brace back there, it has to sit a little higher.

I also want to make the point again, in case I was misunderstood: I definitely think that AGM batteries are the best, and believe Lifeline makes a superior AGM. But a T105 costs around $100 (you can find them at $90 if you look) while the equivelent Lifeline, the GPL-4C, costs $275. So six T105s runs a little less than $600, while six GPL-4C's is $1,650. If price is no object, go for the AGMs. But remember, neither the Trojan nor the Lifeline will last more than four of five years, so you are going to be paying again down the road. I happly tell myself I am getting paid for checking the water a couple times a year!
The other benefits mean even less to me. Holding a charge better? Who is sitting around holding a charge? I am either using the coach, pulling current myself, or parked at home, plugged in. Takes less time to charge? Well, I have a roof full of solar, so I rarely run my generator anyway. Have to equalize? My solar charger does an auto- equalize, so as long as I am parked in the sun I get a quick equalize every morning.

Again, everyone has different needs, and if you are not trying to maximize amp-hours, or if you have so much money you don't care, the Lifeling AGM is great. For my individual situation, I believe T105's are the best choice.

Al Colby

2000 Intrigue 10979

Quote from: mainecoons0

Re: House Battery debate

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 23020
Thank you Allan, the photos really show how it is done. Really appreciate it.

Dan Houck
Allure #30180