Black Tank Odor

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Black Tank Odor

October 30, 2006, 09:40:36 pm

We have started getting black tank odor in the coach immediately after we dump and then start moving. It started about 3 weeks into this 6 week trip. We'ver used several different deodorants, but nothing seems to really stop the initial smell and transfer through the coach. We have started cracking the window in the toilet to vent out the smell. This seems to work.
Got any ideas? I might try to flush the tank better, but this coach doesn't have a built-in flush mechanism. I'm wondering if it's an air pressure problem within the coach/black tank?

Thanks
David

2002 Allure #30682

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #1 – October 30, 2006, 10:03:54 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26557

We have had our 2004 Allure for 45 days now and have the same problem as you , this weekend we were camping and in one of my wifes mags , she found one of the perfume adds, and we put it in the bathroom , it worked great, I need to pull the W/C and find out why we get the smell. We have the extra flush system, but a lot of '' black'' is left in the tank, after using it this morning.

So do I keep the purfume add, or fix the W/C? John 04 Allure 31060 ,

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #2 – October 30, 2006, 10:11:09 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26558

David,

The black tank has an input and an output. Assuming there are no other possibilities except the level sensing pads, the input is the toilet and the output is the plumbing to the slide valve. If the odor occurs upon draining, the output is suspect. There is a panel covering the valve area - remove it and observe the area during draining. If that's OK, then the toilet is suspect.
Fred Kovol

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #3 – October 31, 2006, 01:50:32 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26561

I have a 2003 Allure, that did give off an order that could bring tears. As you say just after disconnect and flush. I found that the water level in the toilet had to be there, and I could not keep the driver side window open when we just started. I was going to check top vent, but good cleaning and a new toilet and it all went away.

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #4 – October 31, 2006, 07:12:22 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26564

We USED TO have those odor problems, until I got wise. EVERY time I dump the tanks, I FLUSH them both thoroughly using the built-in flush system. THEN I add two scoops of powdered tank deodorant (ODORLESS) and about ½ gallon of water to each tank. We've never had a smell going down the road ... 13,000 miles and 69 campgrounds this summer.
Occasionally, if I've left a roof vent fan on and failed to open any windows while parked, the negative pressure inside the coach appears to suck up odors through the washing machine from the grey tank.

Good luck,

Joe On-The-Road at Seffner , FL
'04 Allure 36' #31031

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #5 – October 31, 2006, 07:58:43 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26565

Good morning Campers,

The gray tank can be as bad or maybe worse then the black tank when producing bad smells.
Remember, that it is important to have water in the "P" traps to avoid gray tank smell from entering the coach. A frequent culprit is the washing machine, especially if you have not used it in a while and travel in a hot climate.
Just before starting out I usually add a little extra water to the toilet (raising the lever on the manual toilets or using the push button on the electric).
A sure way to reduce the chance of smell almost 100% from either tank is to add the venturi type cowls to the top of back and gray outlets on the roof.
Just like the attic vents you see on some houses, they rotate according to the direction of the wind and any air movement from any direction causes the venturi effect that completely eliminates the pressure in the holding tank. Instead of the smell being sucked inside the coach it is sucked out into the big blue yonder.
Usually there is a vendor at the bigger rally's who will install them. I think we paid $30 each installed on our prior coach. You could do it yourself, just make sure you like heights and have your medical insurance paid up!

David

David and Karen (and a very spoiled tuxedo, aka Kat) 2006 Allure Siskiyou 31383
2002 Honda Odyssey TOAD

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #6 – October 31, 2006, 08:29:35 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26567

Also if you don't use the washing machine frequently, the water in the P trap evaporates and allowing odors to pass. Personally I can not always tell difference between gray and black tank odors - they both stink like hell. So one of my first steps upon smelling foul odors is to run a bit of water through washing machine to be sure P trap has water in it.

Bob Amory

2002 Allure 30760

Black Tank Odor

Reply #7 – October 31, 2006, 08:48:21 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26568

THanks for the input threads.

I pulled the access door and nothing is leaking while dumping. I'm wondering.... is the seal (?) around the bottom of the toilet cracked and with the negative air pressure caused by rolling down the road brings unpleasant stuff through the crack? I haven't looked around the bottom of the toilet, but I find it strange that a toilet would just fail. They are porcelean and I suppose they can crack. We did put clear wrap over the top of the toilet which worked once. The second time we weren't so successfull...
I did put some odor control stuff down the grey tank just to make sure it hasn't gone sour also. We do run the dishwasher into the sink and, I guess, anything is possible.

Stay tuned.
David

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #8 – October 31, 2006, 08:50:14 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26569

Hadn't read David's post before posting same thing about washing machine. Those venturi cowls he mentioned do work. We used to get odor when and someone, other than the driver, used the toilet while traveling. Venturi cowl on black vent pipe stopped that. Until that is the cowl separated from the mounting. We think that was the strange roof noise we heard going through Cape May NJ last spring.
Fortunately it didn't crash through toad windshield. I understand mfgr will replace, as it was a problem with the early units. According to information I got at the big Hershey RV Show in September, Coil N'Wrap now owns the company that made the venturi cowls. Planning to send mine in for replacement.

Bob Amory

2002 Allure 30760

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #9 – October 31, 2006, 09:39:30 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26570

I would get on the roof and also check for some little critter or debris build up on the vent. When you drain your tank the reverse has occurred in regards to venting. This is the reason I think for odor. Some time ago I installed the rotating vent in place of the standard cap. This little cap turns to always face the wind. The design pulls air from the holding tank. I have to say that it really works 110%. One little glitch... if you have your roof vent open in the head and the wind turns the vent this will give your nose a work out. Other then that rare happening we have not had any odor sense the installation.
AL

00 affinity #5851

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #10 – October 31, 2006, 01:06:59 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26572

I wrestled with this issue for a couple of months. I had this problem even after I installed the venturi cowls for both the grey and black water tanks. I also changed the toilet seal and the plastic vents under the kitchen and bathroom sinks and I always filled the P traps. Once while on top of the MH, I noticed a strong/fowl, black water type odor coming from the grey tank vent, but the black tank vent had no oder. Probably because I always flushed the black tank out, but never the grey tank. After I got the grey tank squeaky clean, the problem went away. I'm not sure, but maybe the grey tank oders were coming from the WD P trap, which I never figured out how to fill. I used Dawn dish soap to flush out both tanks about 10 times each and also ran it down the road with half-full tanks and a half bottle of Dawn in each tank. I periodically get on top of the MH and check the tank vents for odor.
We have no more smells now. Good luck.

Larry 2003 Allure #30856

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #11 – October 31, 2006, 06:14:45 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26577

And here I thought I was the only one with stinky ------, My wife and I both can not understand the smell in the bathroom. We had a trailer before the C.C, and we never had any smell, but what we did different on it, we did not have the flushing system, so we would dump the black tank and then re fill it to the top with water, then drain it again. So I just finished doing that with both gray and black and I put some bleach in the hose to spray inside the gray tank , I will sniff the vent tomorrow to see what it did, just hope no one sees me sniffing the vent!
I also pulled the water closet out and there was evidence of leakage, so I will replace the seal tomorrow.

John 04 Allure 31060

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #12 – October 31, 2006, 06:37:42 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26578

Yes, I think some of my odors came from the gray water tank. I use the ODOR-LESS brand chemical in my tanks. Every so often putting one in the gray water tank before hitting the highway. Seems to work and the odors have disappeared.
AL

00 affinity #5851

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #13 – October 31, 2006, 07:04:05 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26581

Having sniffed a few vents myself I am reminded of two issues. First CC told me to make sure there was water in the sink trap in the bath room. Secondly, I was told to always keep the black tank wet, and use baking soda in both tanks. My issue came up in the summer high heat, and I have found that you simple must flush the black tank completely like fill with 30 to 40 gallons of water at least three times. The CC book says not to close the black valve, but I do in order to fill the tank. I have only forgotten to open the valve once!
I have been order free and I did not install the vent adaptors though I do not think it is a bad idea.

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #14 – October 31, 2006, 08:25:49 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26585

I've been using the "Geo Method" for some time now and haven't had to give much thought to this problem since using it.

Mike

Magna #5266

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #15 – October 31, 2006, 09:28:53 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26586

Maybe I missed something in the thread. Whats the Geo Method? I can imagine, but I hope that's not what you have in mind!!

Bob Amory

2002 Allure 30760

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #16 – November 01, 2006, 12:35:22 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26589

Reference for the Geo Method is

http://cbruni.googlepages.com/home
Was clued into this years ago on another forum before I owned a Country Coach.
Mike

Magna #5266

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #17 – November 01, 2006, 02:59:40 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26590

We had a black water odor problem in our 2007 Allure when we had a negative pressure in the coach (fans running without enough windows open) which we traced to the improper sealing of the pipe as it went through the roof. It really surprised me. Here is what was found:

Holes are drilled through the roof for the vent pipes. The roof is put on the coach, but sometimes the vent pipes are not long enough.
Vent caps are attached, but, because of the short pipe, air is drawn into the coach, through the vent caps and down the larger roof holes, when there is a negative pressure in the coach. It doesn't take much sewer smell coming up the pipe to be drawn down the roof hole into the coach to smell in the coach.

How long should the pipe be? Long enough to go through the large hole AND through the TIGHT COLLAR in the vent cap base. This blocks air, rain and sewer smell access to the hole in the roof.

On two of my vents, the pipe was a 1/2 to 3/4 inch too short. Just take off the vent cap and see if the collar in the vent base TIGHTLY seals the pipe. If it doesn't, since it is difficult to extent the pipe just a little, it is necessary to remove the vent cap base, seal the gap between the larger roof hole and the vent pipe (putty tape and then sealant), reinstall vent base, and cap.

No more smell, in our case.

Also, try the Drakkar test!!! Sprinkle some after-shave lotion down and/or around the vent pipe on the roof, and then sniff in the coach.

Herb

2007 Allure #31466

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #18 – November 01, 2006, 11:52:42 am

Yahoo Message Number: 26598

Now that is a great idea, it beats my method of early morning investigation, Gee I love this forum!!!!

Re: Black Tank Odor

Reply #19 – November 01, 2006, 12:01:45 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26599

Like Mike, I found this method several years ago when I had a Dutch Star. The odor just gradually got worse over time -- however, after using this method (which I repeated about every 6-8 months depending on use), I never had any more odor issues.

John, Linda, and Lollipop
'06 Inspire DaVinci #51905
'02 Saturn

Re: Black Tank Odor Geo Method

Reply #20 – November 02, 2006, 04:56:04 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26620

Did I read correctly that you guys on the Geo Method are NOT using CampaChem/Thetford etc, chemicals (either biodegrable or formaldehyde)?

Bob Amory

2002 Allure 30760

Re: Black Tank Odor Geo Method

Reply #21 – November 02, 2006, 05:27:42 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26622

Hi,

I stopped using RV chemicals/additives over two years ago and essentually use the "Geo method" - no smells. I use kitchen sink detergent and ocassionally TSP (tri sodium phosphate from ACE hardware).

Fred Kovol

Re: Black Tank Odor Geo Method

Reply #22 – November 02, 2006, 06:00:19 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26624

Right. The Geo method uses (chlorine) bleach, detergent and a chemical water softener/conditioner. No need for perfume, it kills any bacteria so enzimes would be useless, and who uses formaldehyde any more?

John 04 Inspire 51078

Re: Black Tank Odor Geo Method

Reply #23 – November 02, 2006, 07:41:30 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26626

Correct. The only part of the official Geo Method that I don't use is the bleach. Don't see a need for it since the tanks stay clean. One addition is the use of baking soda or TSP in the final cleanout before I park it in the garage for any length of storage. I also dislike dumping bleach into campground septic systems. My coach tanks are temporary holding tanks and don't require bacterial action as a septic system does so it would be nice to thoroughly rinse with bleach, but that's not fair to campground owners. They need that bacterial action. A municipal system might not have trouble with bleach simply because your volume would be insignificant, but I've always avoided using bleach anyway since even my home is on its own septic system and have learned to use minimum amounts of bleach in laundry.

Mike

Bob Amory wrote:

Re: Black Tank Odor Geo Method

Reply #24 – November 02, 2006, 08:54:28 pm

Yahoo Message Number: 26628

Fred, so I have a question. How is it that the grey water already has soap in it from doing laundry and has a strong odor if we do not add "Odorless" or some other chemical? Does the water softener make that much difference in the odor of the water in the tanks? This sounds interesting but we have experienced strong odor from the grey water in the past. Any enlightenment will be appreciated. Hollicks 07 Affinity 6767

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